Shinonda: "you dont have to date me, just sleep with me"
But also shinoda,
Shinoda: "if i ask you to break up with your gf would you do it??"
*proceed to constantly nag ikeuchi for not asking him to date him yet act surprised when he finally did it*
Ugh, as much as I like re-reading it, I still hate the fact that he basically pushed ikeuchi to date him... and the cherry on top is that during the relationship he kept comparing himself to girls because he is too self concious. Boy you asked for it (￣ε(#￣)Σ
Where is there always new characters popping out of nowhere??
Like wtf the bus isnt even that huge lmao
I understand rape is disgusting but this is the work of fiction. Let the author be free and draw what they like. So many authors gave the disclaimer "THIS IS THE WORK OF FICTION, ANY RESEMBLECE bla bla bla" and yet people cant take it. "IT REFLECS REAL LIFE" or "THIS IS LIKE REAL LIFE".
BITCH THERES A DISCLAIMER??????? LIKE ITS NOT ENOUGH FOR YOU???
Ill say it again and again, FICTION IS FICTION even if you think that its relatable or very real life like for you. dont be an immature little shit by taking it personally. If you dont like rape dont read it, if you dont like gore dont read it, if you dont like shotacon dont read it. Etc.
I personally dont like yuri so I dont read it, but do i think that it is a sick preference? No. Do I think its disgusting for people to read it? No. Do I bash those who read it or do I bash the author for it? No. Because Im not a sensitive little bitch.
I agree that people who are underage should not read it but they are not supposed to be on adult platform either. We should not ban the site because it is meant for public. Do you ban youtube because you think youtube may teach children violence? No, you create youtube for kids. Adults should watch over them to not open adult sites and Developer should make a platform for underage readers. (Webtoon for teenagers for example)
Mate if you think a disclaimer is all that's needed to make up for harmful or problematic works - yes even if it's fiction lol - you need to understand the impact stuff like this has on real life. Readers are more than allowed to criticize and comment on problematic content, it doesn't make anyone a 'sensitive little bitch'.
Additionally, pretending Yuri is comparable to Rape or shortacon is just bad taste dude.
I hope you manage to do a bit more reflection on why things like these are problematic and not undone purely with a simple disclaimer. Good luck in your growth, maybe don't be so fast to call everyone a little bitch.
facts
How is this a problematic work?
Of course readers are more than allowed to critize a work. But isnt it foolish to bash a work that they know will contains things that they are not into?
History books contains rape do you bash them? Fictional novels contains rape do you bash them? But do you think we should burn the book that contains rape or choose books that suit our taste instead? Do you think we should limit every creators creativity in their work to suit our own taste?
I did not meant to compare yuri , yaoi and rape as the same thing. However these genres are not acceptable by society therefore i use it as an example. I use gore as an example as well didnt I? Why is it matter so much? Focus on what im saying "dude".
I call everyone little bitch because they whine about every little thing and its ridiculious. Sure, you think I did not know why these works is seen as "problematic" but yes I do know why. But to assume that work of fiction will change a person's personality is farfetched.
The place that youre growing up in is what affect your character. Build you as a person. Adult around you is the people who affect your perspective as a person. Therefore yes, if you can read and understand what a disclaimer is, I think it is more than enough to give warning to its reader. If the reader is smart they know what they will get into.
Is it now?
I think to put it simply, if I read rape manga do I become a rapist? if I read yuri do I becomr a lesbian? If I read yaoi do I become gay? If I read gore do I become a killer?
I think the problem in many mangas and webtoons is that the rape is romanticised which is not okay. Thats where the issue arises.
Romanticising rape in a work of fiction is not healthy. There is a reason why 13 reasons why got so much heat because it glorifies suicide and romanticised it.
But then again. To each their own. You do what you want to do (●￣(ｴ)￣●)
Mate that's such a simplistic argument hahahahaha
Reread my comment before you pretend I'm trying to say anything about 'bashing' or 'burning' lol
I called you out for crying about 'little bitches' because you claimed a disclaimer means we can't criticize problematic content - which is plain incorrect. Don't try to turn the comment into this huge weird thing I'm supposedly saying about how we need to act in regards to problematic content in works of fiction haha
I hope you manage to have a nice day and get some clarity, rather than trying to twist a simple criticism of you insulting people into some weird grandstand about how we need to burn or bash art and fiction in our world.
Take care
13 reasons why was such a hot mess of glorifying unhealthy mental health haha
As one of my friends said, "No if I write fiction that portrays black people as criminals do I become a racist yes. If I write fiction that trivialises and glorifies rape am I a dumbfuck possible sexist fool yes. If I consume and promote than fiction am I likely to trivialize rape yes. Am I dumb yes. Am I a bad person for liking rape fics I dunno you gotta think my man."
Love, I dont think I need to re-read your comment but YOU need to re-read mine.
Yes, you called me out for it and I answered it.
No, I didnot say YOU were bashing the author but i said will you or would you bash the author for creating a fictional manga that you yourself know that it will contain things you are not into or you should smart read and choose wisely yourself. Will you burn the entire platform or try and filter the content yourself.
And yes, you can critize the content. But for example, I didnot like Gore and the disclaimer already warned me "WARNINGS! IT CONTAINS GORE" and I keep on reading, after that I leave a negative comment and bash the author for making a gore manga, calling the author a sycopath. Do you think this is wise? Dont you think its stupid? You already read the disclaimer and you proceed to read it. So yes, disclaimer is important. What more do you want? I understand if the critism make sense. However now it is a thin line between pure hate comment and constructive critism. People tend to cross it.
I did not try to twist your comment. I simply answer them and give my reasoning. You feel that way yourself, it could be your own delusion.
Creators are afraid to express their story because of this kind of reasoning.
If I were to create a story where the criminals was a person of color why am I automatically a racist? So it is okay if I make the criminals a white person? Isnt this just the same? Assuming white people as a criminals? Am I a racist too? Or should I make no criminals at all if this matter somehow connected to racism? In everything I do, it will be problematic anyway then.
What if it was a pure coincidence that the criminals in my story is a person of color? Am i still a racist?
If everything connected to everything, we should also question our perspective. Do we always see everything in the negative light?
If I make the heroine in my story as a damsel in distress then I must be an anti-feminist, because I dont see them as a strong independent woman.
If in my story I make the villain or the hero misogynist for the sake of the story then I must be one too?
If I make a story where the villain is fat and ugly then I must be fatphobia?
And yes, romanticizing rape in manga is problematic and ridiculious, but in fictional world, even stalking people is romantic. In real life we have consequences, for example imprisonment, which is why rape in manga can somehow lead to marriage. H mangas are the prime example. Its disgusting but it will never represent real life situation. However again, the idea of changing a person's personality by reading fictional works is farfetched. But we can still avoid it by smart read.
A thin line yes, which is why we have to open out mind and free ourselves from prejudice.
I guess, when a fictional story has characters that coincidence with real life events, people quickly shut down the entire story. Regardless of the message and the plot.
And I dont see a problem if I made that simple argument? I have a point didnt I? I would rather you answer that to read pointless "haha" in the end of every sentences you made.
Maybe I should also say, we should remove all rape mangas, all gore mangas, allllll yuri and yaoi mangas. Because like I said, people are sensitive little bitch, they hate on everything they cant take and whine about it hoping everything will be all sunshine and rainbows.
Yes, we should all always read detective conan.
Rather than to read***
I said simplistic - not simple, there is a difference. A simplistic argument is one that takes what was being said and twists it into something nonsensical, or is an argument that simply doesn't benefit the current discussion.
In this instance, you decided to take a criticism of you raging at people who dare comment on problematic content and pushed it to a nonsensical extreme in which you pretended 'I read bad thing so I am bad thing's was ever brought up or important to the discussion - it wasn't and the argument you made existed to detract from my original statement by making is seem ridiculous, because you twisted it to the extreme in a extremely simplistic way. Hence, I didn't engage as the idea you were pitching had nothing to do with the initial issue - you seemingly being very upset that readers dare criticize even if there is a disclaimer.
Look it's pretty obvious to me from your other comment that you don't actually understand systematic oppression and the power structures that exist in our society on every level - and fiction doesn't exist in a vacuum, racist content is influenced by and influences racism if the world. Romanticized rape does feed back into violent concepts and thoughts - no it's not as easy as 'I read blah so I am blah', but these things absolutely feed into oppressive and violent structures and behaviors in the world, even if it's on a micro scale. As you seem to believe works of fiction exist in a bubble that don't feed into problematic concepts in our world, us arguing about this is pointless.
Instead I will again repeat the simple comment I made on my original post - disclaimers do not take readers rights away to criticize. I am not talking about 'hate posts' or 'bashing authors' as your original post did not seem to include or specify only these - your original post was based on 'let the author do whatever they want because a disclaimer is enough and if you don't you're a little bitch' - and that is plain incorrect.
I agree with you. While many yaoi contains rape, the viewers should be aware that the author is designing a story for a 18+ audience. As such we should be responsible for reading mature themes and take responsibility for our thoughts and actions, which is why this story is aimed for an adult audience.
If you’re sensitive to rape and psychological themes, TAKE RESPONSIBILITY and don’t read it. The author has a clear disclaimer to warn the readers. But does this mean that all of the problematic pot lines are excused? No, it isn’t. HOWEVER, we can’t ignore that romanticising rape is prominent in many works of fiction, so as a audience we have to take up the responsibility of reading these types of stories.
So does this mean the author is at fault for writing this story? NO. The author has warned us of the sensitivity content ahead, so we shouldn’t blame or criticise them for writing the story. YOU have to remember that some authors enjoy drawing and writing sensitive story lines, which is why they place warnings FOR US as a audience. The author clearly tells us that the story is aimed for a 18+ audience with mature themes, so it is expected that as a mature audience, we are sensible enough TO NOT BE INFLUENCED BY THE NEGATIVE AND PROVOKING THEMES AND TO NOT BRING HARMFUL THOUGHTS INTO REAL LIFE.
I know that many people have their perspectives on the issue of rape but we have to understand that since we are reading this on a website like Mangago instead of Lezhin comics. There are many underage people reading this story, and many of them comment on the rape and abuse in stories, its understandable that they are concerned on this issue. HOWEVER, it doesn’t make it right to disrespect other people’s opinions. There has recently been a common issue in the comment section where people criticise others for their opinions on the story and its been more noticeable then it has ever been before, and its gotten much more toxic too. I’m not saying that I’m not welcoming the new people coming on to mangago, in fact I’m glad that our community is growing, but because there are more people, there are some who don’t take responsibility for what they read. REMEMBER THIS STORY IS FOR A MATURE AUDIENCE.
While readers have the right to criticise the story, KEEP IN MIND THAT THIS STORY IS FOR A MATURE AUDIENCE, and that YOU SHOULD TAKE RESPONSIBILITY FOR WHAT YOU READ, there are age restrictions for a reason.
If you are sensitive to rape THEN DON’T READ IT. We as an audience have the responsibility to think critically about what we read and what we do with the information we consume. Which is why many yaoi and webtoons are for a 18+ audience.
So don’t go around saying inappropriate things about the author or others that enjoy these types of stories. They shouldn’t be hated on if they enjoy reading it. REMEMBER THIS IS FOR A MATURE AUDIENCE AND TAKE RESPONSIBILITY FOR WHAT YOU READ.
Im sorry what? Argument that doesnt benefit the current situation? I think that "simplistic" comment does help what Im trying to say unless you refuse to try and understand it. And systematic oppression?? What are you trying to drag here?
In my original comment I said, "Do I bash the reader and the author? No" and I adressed that and I didnot try to detract you from your original statement and twist them. Do you know how many death threats, how many nasty comment etc author and their readers get for enjoying mangas that contains rape? Many. Therefore you as an Adult who reads mangas that contains sensitive subject has to filter and decide yourself. So to answer you whether Disclaimer itself is enough yes, disclaimer is enough to warn the readers. Am i still twisting something here?
And no, I do not understand the systematic oppression and power structures that youre trying to drag here.
But if we change the subject to RACISM, it is a very wide subject. Because true, our views and perspective can be affected by our ancestor's work. ( Especially the fact that they normalize racism) . But dont take it as it is, we are not brainless idiots therefore we cant translate every work and connected it into racism. It is where it gets problematic.
As for the romantizied rape, the view of mangas and fanfiction can feed into oppressive and violent structure comes from movies. For example it is always portrayed that a psychopath read something off internet then they conducted the criminal act after. Is it a possibility? Perhaps. A very very small one, micro scale? Or below micro or not at all? However it is more complex than something like that. Is it what we READ that makes us a rapist? Then why doesnt it affect everyone who read it? Why isnt everyone a rapist?
Like I said before, adult and the enviornment we are in affect who we are. The place we grow up on. Its not what we READ that affect us. The person with abusive history, drug, alcohol etc is the most likely to conduct rape. Because that is the "picture" that they grow up on. It happens to a real person around them. It affect their brain and their way of thinking.. and rape is sadly a primal insinct that is surpressed within us. Adult is responsible for their action, we have to teach them that it has consequences. Therefore smart read is important, warn our younger generations that it is something wrong.
And again, im calling people as sensitive little bitch because when they see sensitive content they will attack the author and ban their work, even though they have been warned and there is a disclaimer written. And I am only calling people who do so.
True. My issue is that the comments does affect the author psychologically. It shows on the recent work of most creators. For example they change their plotline into lighter stories and predictable outcomes. They are afraid of the readers who bash them because of what they created in the past.
I think people today are more sensitive. Disclaimer is no longer enough. Everything turns into problem and it really is limiting people on what they do. I am fine with people who wants to voice their opinion but some people make the dumbest comment.
On the other hand, I am also glad. If people leave a comment expressing their concern it means they are sane enough to understand whats wrong and whats right.
Preach(๑•ㅂ•)و✧.. I was trying to target some of the things fluffy duck said, so sorry if i came off as offensive in any way bc it might sound like i was dragging out random points.
I just mainly wanted to tell people off about attacking fans and the author and to stay away, because its toxic behaviour. I’m glad to see someone stand up against it bc not many people do so in the comments. There are so many people that just add on to the attacks.
Yeah its okay. Im not good with words and there are many things I want to express but its hard to explain. I feel like my statement is too long to read but I hope if people want to read it they can understand what I meant.
I forgot to address this as well. Although it may be problematic, the romanticization of rape in fictional story is a way to satisfy a certain community that enjoy this kind of story, or to some, it serves as a "guilty pleasure". The same as bdsm, it is not something normal. But some people enjoy it as a way to satisfy their fantasy alone.
Like I said before, the idea of this (referring to romanticization of rape in fiction) changing, turning or educating people that this kind of act in Real Life is okay is farfetched. Because again, this act is in anyway did not portray real life action or is unrealistic.
This kind of act in mangas is not meant to be realistic therefore this kind of plotline can be seen as something absurd and ridiculious to its readers. To call it as "glorifying rape" is a bit too much sometimes.
Real people are portrayed in the work. Like what? If you're gonna portray rape at least portray it negatively and don't continue to force a relationship between rapist and victim.
THIS. THIS. THIS. THIS. LITERALLY THIS. Like that's all I'm fucking asking for, don't make it a pleasant thing.
The only problem I have with rape in a fiction is if its a rape then show it as something bad, cruel, negative. I hate it when they dont discuss about rape as "rape". A lot of scenes will go like "I'm sorry i hurt you" "No baby, its my fault, pls forgive me" and boom they get back together. Hello??? Huh? Why show rape then??
Including rape for shock value is poor execution. Thats it. Everything should have a meaning.
I frankly dont understand how rape kink works. And I'm not sure if the author actually wanted to cater to that audience tbh. The disclaimer FOR SURE did not mention that its made for that specific community :)
I dont understand what you are trying to say here. BDSM has consent. Rape doesnt.
Going by your logic we shouldnt bash pedophiles for liking shotacon no? :)
WEIRD
I've explain over and over again that rape in fictions especially in mangas are very ridiculious because fictional work has its own universe where the criminals and crimes has little to no consequences. It does not represent actual crimes in real life which is why mangas mostly portrays ridiculious scenarios. This is also the reason why it should never be taken seriously and should stay in the fictional world. In real life is completely different scenario. There is real consequences, criminals are punished and jailed for what they do and they deserve it. There is a real - breathing - beings, a real persons life and futures ruined by that crime.
BDSM does involve consent, and so is feederism and other fetishes. But my point is, those fetishes is considered as taboo. It is not something normal but people involved in it does not deserve to be bashed for it. As much as I respect people's preferences, i didnot condone extreme fetishes irl. There is some instances where in extreme BDSM (in real life), the person involved bleed and slapped until they are bruised. Even if consent is involved that is still sychotic behavior. I feel extreme concern and those people actually need help. In fictional work however, as much as it is concerning, I pay no mind to it. When I cannot take it, I leave it.
And by my logic, not all people who are into shotas are an actual pedophiles. Some enjoy the visuals of petite and cute characters. I do not bash people who read the shota mangas, I bash the people and geezers who touch actual children. Disgisting geezers on the news, geezers who are currently jailed deserve to die for touching children who cannot give consent and scarring them for life. All of them.
And funny how your setting make me unable to reply to your comment @Datenshi
Im not mad but whats with yaoi these days??? Sex scenes on the first chapter already? No thrilling story to develop & no heart breaking plot twist? I like old yaoi mangas / manhwas more. There is a story to tell and you can literally be super delighted or cry as the story progress.
I thought about that too .that's the problem with manhwaangas are still taking it slow.but this one is a good read
Honestly, when you read comments of *some* thirsty fujoshi/fudanshi you'll understand why authors go down this road. I've seen people complain about the lack of smut when stories took just a few chapters off to actually focus on the plot. Or whine about it in the beginning, when the story was just a few chapters in and the guys hadn't banged yet.
So, I'm guessing they're just trying to pull those readers in ASAP while knowing that others who enjoy the story too will give in and suffer through the meaningless sex in order to get to the good parts and smut that actually has purpose and doesn't feel like dry porn.
a lot of people reading these stories read this purely to sexualize gay men and not the plot
Uh oh I saw some replies and its gone somehow?? Wth??
Nvm the comments are back. Thank you, I understand why now. Its sad to see that authors has to go down this road. I feel like there are almost no difference between yaoi manwhas & mangas with typical hentai or H comics today. It would be better if at least the first few chapters are made for the story, I enjoy hardcore smut too but the lack of progress is just depressing to read.
Yeah, totally agree
For those who complaints about the non - consent or rape or drugs or whatever, theres literally a warning before you read. So dont be stupid.
I didnot condonde any of the illegal or fucked up act in this manga in anyway but we should not bash the author or assume the author as a rapist or a fucked up person for making this manga. It is a freedom of writing, no matter how shitty or how good it is we should never ban or calling the author names.
This is a work of fiction so please, take it as a fiction.
If I have to give my opinion, I hate the story and the twist is a flop for me. Especially how most of them are cheaters in a way or "dirty". It is however a matter of a personal preferences, I did not like polyamorous relationship and cheaters while other people might like it.
+1!!
Im sorry but im laughing my ass off. The contrast between the uke and the seme is just *mwachhh* perfection. The uke is like "ε=ε=(ノ≧∇≦)ノ wahh so romantic,hello kitty,cutee, the butterflies are dancing hahaha ٩(๑❛ᴗ❛๑)۶" and the seme is just like "yo, suck my dick."
You described it so perfect lmaoooo. The uke is so nice, kind and so so cute. I absolutely adore him (≧∀≦)
Ikrr. I love them borh and I get to see more (●'◡'● )ﾉ adorableee
Love them both and I hope I get to see more ***
Some people in the comment sections are probably gonna say this GLORIFY STALKING and stalking is not okayyy. :v ruining the story for me.
Rape gore etc are not normal and seen as something frown upon, which is completely understandable and ofc the right thing to do. However, in the world of writing or story telling people has the freedom to express dark side of society. What do we get from expecting all fiction story to be always vanilla and normal? Boring cliche and repeated use of happy ending. People expected to see that and those who are not are called maniac and ill. This is still a public platform, people have their own taste.
Mangas that contains Rape is GLORIFYING RAPE, then mangas that contains Gore is GLORIFYING MURDER? Why do people always take this glorify this that glorify that. Its not the author that has to change the story, but the people who reads need to change their way of thinking. Its the same case with video games deemed to contain violence and has to be ban, its not the game but the people. Parents need to monitor what their children is watching, not complaining to the public platform for what their children is seeing. If you worry that minors will see gore and rape as something okay then it is our job to remind them it is not instead of demanding the writer to be more normal.
All violence in mangas is not a REALISTIC portrayal of anything. Thats why in mangas there are no consequences while in real life we have. Nobody will be happy if rape were to happen to them, in mangas as it is not realistic, some can be fucked up enough to enjoy it and become lovers. Why? Because it is not in anyway meant to be realistic.
People are limiting freedom in writing. Thats the only shit I had enough of. People ban this and ban that. I have read many stories, from normal, not normal, disgusting everything and I see how fucked up that is. It does not change me as a person, just opened another perspective. Rape happens in real life, and I have more than enough wrath to put those rapist in hell. If I see a video of a person raped would I enjoy it? No. Thats disgusting and a criminal act that I would not tolerate ever. Because it involves a real person in pain, a real persons life destroyed and i feel the sympathy as the same human being that I am. If I see a person killed do I feel happy? Why the fuck would I? Seeing another persons life is taken away slice my heart in half. The most severe punishment is fit for those who truly hurt others.
I dont see the necessity to say rape is disgusting in a manga that meant to contain one or bashing the author for writing a story about rape.
Minors is not supposed to be here in the first place. Which is why there are many platform out there that fits them better and we can tell them so. Or parents or any other guardian do so. Society is dark, all those traumatizing events that happen in real life is what changed us as a person. The idea of fictional story tell them is okay to do such act is already far fetched. We have a common sense, common enough to know which one is wrong and which one is right.
Killer, murder and rapist exist even before mangas, novels and movie does. Its the people that can shape others. Pinning any fictional platform as a factor that can change others is odd.
I'm sorry. I wanted to vote up but accidentally click the wrong button!! (￣ε(#￣)Σ
No worries. As long as you got the message.
Legit, good story without all that cliche, very very very well drawn, original in its own way and fuuccckkk they all are hotttt.
I rarely see good mangas / manhwas nowadays, its always that cringeworthy romance with too much sex in the opening scene or just pretty much H story all the way... I think its rare to find a balanced proportions of romance and H in mangas, people are too fixated on sex. I definitely love H stuff but still.... it can get really boring (づ￣ ³￣)づ