do you ever wish there was an option to block having to see a particular manga when you visit this site? Like god i remember that manga and hated it, let me just block it and never have to see it or its comments ever again.
Blood bank yes
not manga, some mangago users yes lol
do people have BL recs that have delinquent seme/tops? I barely see any most of them if not all that I've read has the delinquent always bottom.
I want to know a delinquent seme too （/TДT)/, is not tht I hate delinquent bottom but delinquent seme is more on my kind (￣ε(#￣)Σ
Rutte to kodama is a cute one !
I mean rutta not rutte ╥﹏╥
Challenge accepted : http://www.mangago.zone/read-manga/sneaky_red/
Sneaky Red is about a masochistic boy attracted to a delinquent who happened to punch him several times in the streets.
Don't be fooled by the tags, I feel like a lot of people didn't understand what it's about（￣へ￣）
I appreciate the rec. but this may not be for me. I’m not a fan of abusive violence turn to live sort. But thank you really.
Love*
even if it's consensual violence? :) ok I know some sweet stories with delinquent seme.
recently there was this one about a transfer student and a deliquent, but it's still ongoing : http://www.mangago.zone/read-manga/eyes_speak_more_love_than_the_mouth/
Fortunately, this one has the exact same plot and is completed : http://www.mangago.zone/read-manga/asatte_ni_kiss/
Shinobeba Koi, about bikers, could do the job :
http://www.mangago.zone/read-manga/shinobeba_koi/
If it's not enough there are also yaoi with delinquent uke AND seme like Megumi to Tsugumi or Abarenbo Honey. And many with yakuza seme, or else I know stories with the usual plot of the bad guy teasing the uke, if it's more the kind of seme you like. I'm still there ready to do a quick search if you need =)
You’re too sweet thank you!
i have to wonder do people actually think about the damage caused by authors routinely writing plots about their main character falling in love with their bully? Do people not realize that for queer men how messed up it is to already be attracted to the same sex but to then be attracted to the person who physically and emotionally harms them as well?That's has to be one clusterfuck of insecurities and self hate but then it's romanticized for mainly heterosexual female readers who will never understand how it feels to hate yourself for loving someone who hates you and is validated by their hate by society and your own peers.It is such a seriously fucked up trope and I truly do not understand its appeal.
I've thought about it too. I try to avoid such manga/manhwa. There are lots of amazing authors out there that actually care for the lgbtq+ community and dont just fetishise us.
It's pure fantasy just don't read it then hetero love stories don't accurately portray hetero relationship's either same with Yuri
Ah damn sorry I accidentally pressed the dislike button
oh you are completely right, my issue is this is VERY specific trope that yaoi uses more times than any other and while their are still bully trope plots in both shoju and yuri plots you do not get the same level of blatant love for these toxic relationships.You do however see in heterosexual plots the "turn around" of the bully character but for gay counterparts you have the one being bullied has been in love with their bully the entire time with a personality change doing nothing to lessen that attraction. Best example of that is the recent show SEXEDUCATION on Netflix its a perfect example of this problem of fetishizing homophobia in mediums besides manga.
I totally agree with you. Not only that, but it's super rare to see a main character who is bullied to stand up for himself. Most of them put up with all the shit the other is throwing at them. It frustrate me so much. I don't understand the people who enjoy reading something like that.
P.S I can recommend a gay Tv show which is pretty realistic.
it's no worries :P
Oh that's a very interesting way of viewing things. Thank u for sharing. Personally, I've been teased/bullied (not too extremely tho) my whole life that I sort of grew numb to it, so those tropes feel...normal... to me; but when u pointed that out, I can sort of understand how messed up that can be o.o
also realized i never asked you for that recommendation.
What are people's thoughts on stories where one character adopts and raises the other like their own child for years, but then they start a romantic/sexual relationship later on in life even though they're not physically related? Do you count that as incest why or why not? I always feel iffy on plots like that and honestly find the thought of it uncomfortable, but wondered how others rationalize it.
i think in real life......as long as u feel someone as your family/relative ,even if u r not related by blood....and u have relationship with them it is incest
as far as i see in manga it justifies ,....if u r not blood related its not incest
just keep an open mind......do not judge....all of us when we are born we have no rules whom we can love or not.....everything we follow is simply rules of society,to be socially accepted and not be an outcast
scientifically speaking when 2 ppl have sex and have a baby (not talking about gay relationships)......all it counts if u r a male or female.......only the process and outcome counts......evenif it is an incest relationship baby will be born....so nothing is wrong or right.....its all ur mindset.......keep an open mind to explore infinite possibilities.....ur morals should be what u want and not what society expects of u....so i never judge
Physically no, psychologically yes :/
I personally don't support it.
imo, it's still incest because they were raised as that person's child. also, the older person gets to influence the younger's way of thinking which is a whole new can of worms. personally, i think it's gross but everyone has their own opinion.
i mean every is entitled to whatever they want to do as long as it doesn't harm others. I've just wondered if it was a morally gray area for some or rather clear cut in where it falls as taboo.
everyone*
Brother Conflict in my eyes just screams rape and incest, so uerm I know yalls dont want a rec, but yea. . .
(I only liked the art style, and its hard to believe they are all brothers with the hair color the colors of the rainbow
Ahh the age old step-siblings/ cousin quandary. This is one actually does happen in real life and is another morally gray area. I too personally think of it as incest when you purposely are raised in an environment that see's one another as immediate family, but it's another one of those well they're not really related....(at far as step-siblings go)
I mean if we want to reference even main-stream there was the Brady Bunch and the issue of Gossip Girl too almost had the parents married before Serena and Dan did.
Do people have thoughts about yaoi and it’s relationship with toxic masculinity? Is BL actually feminist when it adheres to stereotypes and violence? I am just pondering this question today?
Most of the BL manga reproduce all the toxic behaviours that are in the shoujo manga... you can see it in the figure of the uke, always being feminized. Moreover, the jealousy is always present as a sample of love, etc. well, however i guess that some bl try to go over that problem; i think that "Joshi BL" of Harada is a little example
I actually like Harada a lot for this reason they know they're playing into the stereotype associated with the genre, for example sexual violence, or jealousy but have made it so obviously warped with exaggerated vengeful glee, that the satirical nature and the discomfort they employ highlights these characteristics for the negatives that they are and forces the audience to acknowledge this. It's dark very dark, but the issues they bring up are real in nature not a romantic fictional excursion from reality that so many authors excuse.
Just wondering is it a standard for most yaoi to have the delinquent = "a bitch in heat". I'm not against feminine men at all, but for some reason I thought the point of the delinquent character was suppose to be their hyper masculinity, but this is always usurped to make them quote on quote the "slutty uke". Is it just because they're considered an archetype of masculinity, there's the to appeal have them be feminized? Because it's not even a question of uke vs seme not having a place in homo relationships, but rather the character completely becoming submissive for otherwise no apparent reason to reinstate heteronormative roles. Let's be real they're pushed into an entirely different personality with the introduction of their love interest. Maybe it's the moe? Because I always find it slightly weird when they so easily are overpowered or often times raped by their traditional average joe or just pretty boy ikemen counterpart. Like what happened to all their muscles, is that all for show?
Probably is for the gap moe thing. Rape puts the victim into a state of shock too, so they may not be able to fight back even if they’re stronger.
i disagree with the last thing. when u r about to get raped its like if u r about to get killed, u will do everything in ur power to prevent it instictively. the "shock" phase is during the rape and its true that some people cant defend themselves during the action. but if u like the guy and u r between yes or no thats another thing. some victims tend to refuse that it was actually rape due to the fact that they were too intimate with the person.
What I said refers to men getting raped. People often ask how a man could get raped if they’re the stronger of the sexes, and it is due to shock. It can go either this way, or the fight or flight adrenaline response as you said.
i dont believe that someone would actually stay still due to shock though, sure u would be shocked but ur instincts come first...but yes sometimes it can happen.
happens*
I'm not asking my question in order to question the validity of men experiencing rape or sexual assault, as everyone's reactions or experience with sexual violence differs. TMI i've been sexually assaulted myself and yes I've experienced that moment of frozen shook it's common for individuals where the event happens for the first time. My issue is the gap in personality that allows them to turned into a submissive character solely for the sexual pleasure of another character. They're OOC for the sake of that moment and I don't understand it. Yaoi already relies on unequal power dynamics through the forced categorization of uke and seme, but it's as if the delinquent simply being themselves is seen as a threat so they're essentially castrated to restore the hierarchy.
TRIGGERING:
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As for men being raped and shock having a role in it, it's primarily because male rape is so taboo. The perpetrators of this stigma unfortunately mainly falls on men. Female on male rape is actually the more common of the two that will induce the shock you speak of, because of little merit it is given.Men are more likely not to speak out about being raped by a women than a man. However male on male rape depending on the severity and situation is handled case by case on a individual level based on the victims' experience and various factors (their age, their size, how close they were to their assailant , the environment, etc).It's the same for male on female rape in this regard simply because of the violence of forcibly being taken against your will.
without the "can" ugh its so early.
Yaoi logic is completely different to normal logic. Chalk it up to that. There is a yaoi I read where delinquent tops + essentially rapes but tbf the bottom was also a delinquent, a shit one at that, so yeah...
i personally agree but lets face it, yaoi mangas serve mainly the purpose of satisfying young women. due to that, everything is centered around sex and the authors dont pay much attention in order to build an actual male character. (i cant write a sentence sorry, i only slept for 2 hours ).
:(( i hope you can sleep more.
i dont think i can... i just drank some coffee cause i have work to do :/
The thing is, i've learned to hold my breath when it comes to yaoi and it's relationship with sexual violence it is what is for the most part you can't even deny that rape=love for most mangakas. My issue is when authors utilize a specific archetype like the delinquent and not even use a delinquent but some butchered version of it. As for tops delinquents or bottom ones I have no issue at all in their sexual role that's the beauty of gay sex, it's rather forced change in a character's characterization so that they're reduced in what essentially defines them. I'd even tolerate the delinquent on delinquent rape because that while violent makes sense in a weird way because it falls into place with the nature of delinquent hierarchy. It's like the equivalent of prison rape, the point is establish dominance and dehumanize their victim. Maybe it's because I'm tied up in the need for authors to actually take sexual violence seriously or even how it would play out with certain characters and am always let down by the character accommodating once again to inequality for the sake of their "love interest"
also go to sleep. just ignore me and my ranting.
haha wish i could but i need to file some papers+ buy a gift for a friend.
best of luck!
thank u<3
Ok random question but are there any recommended BL where there isn't rape, coercion, sexual violence, blackmail, lying, bullying, unequal power dynamics, Stockholm syndrome, domestic violence, or homophobia/biphobia to read? But if there is, is actually central to the plot in way that's realistic and addressed realistically with consequences but has a happy ending? I find it much easier to find BL that has the things I don't want, than those that I do. I really just want to cleanse myself at the moment.
I guess it’s becuase it’s kinda hard to find a plot where there isn’t conflict
I don't mind conflict, I mind if any of the above I mentioned are used bogusly I just tired of author's with crap plots throwing in these plot devices calling it "conflict" and moving on once they're bored of it.
Im no sure, maybe like this?
http://www.mangago.zone/read-manga/harenochi_shikibu/
Im not so sure, maybe like this?
http://www.mangago.zone/read-manga/harenochi_shikibu/
just recently read thank you so much for your suggestion otherwise. ABSOLUTELY love this
Thank You! Will give it a read
Try Minaduki Yuu....almost all of sensei's works don't have things you mentioned
I recommend Sayonara Game, prequel: Change world,Love nest
And this one
http://www.mangago.zone/read-manga/hinadori_wa_shiokaze_ni_madoromu/
Try looking into shounen ai. They're usually the easier things to read if you don't want the things you listed.
This isn't shounen ai but I had it in description as cute and something I'd read drinking tea and relaxing so http://www.mangago.zone/read-manga/yamada_to_shounen/
Try dark heaven. It deals with a lot of these issues in a realistic manner, and though there are a lot of conflicts, the ending is wholesome and fulfilling
Also, try Itoshi no Nekokke if you're looking for something lighter and cute (it has some sad scenes but they work it out)
there can be plot without there being rape, coercion, sexual violence, blackmail, lying, bullying, unequal power dynamics, Stockholm syndrome, domestic violence, or homophobia/biphobia.
Ruta To Kodama was one of the purest ones I’ve read. The seme was a bad boy I guess but not a bully, and it’s long term.
I think these will work
(though the uke is kinda homophobe but in realistic way also how he falls for the seme
just try it out)
http://www.mangago.zone/read-manga/castle_mango/
love these
http://www.mangago.zone/read-manga/hachimitsu_darling/
http://www.mangago.zone/read-manga/himegoto_asobi/
http://www.mangago.zone/read-manga/reply/
this is also nice, no heavy plot but not boring
http://www.mangago.zone/read-manga/tonari_ni_iru_no_ni_tooi/
cute
http://www.mangago.zone/read-manga/koisuru_barairo_tenchou/
the couple here started to comfort each other as friends (unrequited love)
http://www.mangago.zone/read-manga/bokura_ga_koi_wo_ushinau_riyuu/
thank you everyone for your posts
thank you!
will give it a look
i've read the one you've linked and loved it but will have to read the other two you've suggested.
Anything by Furuya Nagisa is pure (▰˘◡˘▰)
What is it about abuse and toxic relationships that people find sexy to read and watch? Why is it the number one utilized trope in most genres across the board, that continues to gather audiences from all ages and backgrounds?
I guess you haven’t been corrupted, yet.
Meh. Relationship? Hit and run is better.
Because readers find conflicts intriguing. We like seeing characters being challenged to overcome a situation (which may or may not be resolved). Most fiction is based on some element of conflict, all of which span every genres of manga:
man vs. man
man vs. self
man vs. society
man vs. supernatural
man vs. tech/machinery
We're all just there for the sex
Lmao
Honestly fluff is so boring. Like for 80 chapters all the uke and seme do is UWU each other, not even a fukin kiss. Blush here, Blush there…. UGHHHH So boring. I just want the Seme to pound the Uke so hard till he starts bleeding But Nope nope nope NOT in fluffy Mangas!!! That is the reason why I love hardcore and mangas with fuked up caracters.
I think in this case, the person is asking more why so many people gloss over toxicity and problematic relationships in vast majority of yaoi stories. A conflict/climax is needed in almost every story to keep interest flowing and have readers want to find out more. But in many cases of yaoi stories, the toxicity in the relationship is actually not even used as a conflict at all, in fact it always gets swept over as nothing, or a slight little "misunderstanding" between the two characters, when in reality it's HUGE problems such as non-consensual sex, rape, verbal and/or physical abuse. These types of situations aren't regarded as "conflicts" in these stories, they always get glossed over as "it was just a moment of jealousy", or "it's cause of his tragic past". It gives young readers this idea that if a man does or has any of these toxic characteristics, it's actually because he "loves you", and that right there, is a big problem in society because men or women won't leave their toxic partner since there's the thought that "he/she is only doing this cause they love me".
Things like these shouldn't be overlooked, but the reality is that they almost always are, and authors and also readers almost always refuse to acknowledge in fact just how toxic the relationship actually is, because, like most comments above said, most people are only reading for the sex.
The love-hate trope differs from toxic/abusive relationships. The person is questioning why people overlook yaoi stories where relationships involve things like non-consensual sex, rape, verbal and/or physical abuse.
I love the hate-to-love trope, it's my personal favourite, but just because the two characters hate each other, doesn't excuse for non-consensual sex, or rape, there's absolutely no excuse that justifies any of those actions, but in vast majority of yaoi stories, that's exactly what happens, and the author and readers refuse to acknowledge how wrong those actions are, and it gets glossed over with a couple exhcnages of "I love yous".
Cause it’s yaoi. Lmfao. I
Lmfao, bleeding out on the sidewalk. So hot.
oof got me there my guy
I've said this before- it's a comic book, not a blueprint for real life. Characters/situations are overdramatised in an entertainment medium, so it's fine if readers cheer on the bad character of their choice. The Joker is cool, but a real life psychopath is not ok.
Yeah but the joker's character isn't painted to be this saint or portrayed as the correct form of morality, he's not a character that's glorifying psychopathy.
Toxicity or what you refer to as "entertainment" in yaoi is almost ALWAYS glorified or excused despite how wrong some of this stuff is.
I know rape is a fantasy many people have, especially women. Yaoi is able to give them that fantasy. I would argue that yaoi SHOULD not be read by young people. The ones that contain rape or abuse should be read by mature audiences.
In many cases, Joker is seen as a cool rebel hence why many want to be him (cosplay).