轻轻落下来的叶子

Rather than hypnotize I think it's bcuz of love, most of the s-ranks are feared by people and thought of nothing more then monsters by everyone, so when they get that love from a single person, of course they'll get attached too much to themヽ(￣▽￣)ノ and most of his targets didn't have a good life.

And his Skill is NOT seeing future, he can just see what Skill they can have, it's not that they will have it for sure, so he has to intervene and most the time he doesn't know what the Skills do and how to obtain it

Yoojin IS manipulative, calculating and greedy as fuck, but he also is very caring and overprotective because of his traumatic past, he lost one after another all the people who took care of him and he was attached to, and even had to trample on their corpses to survive so his actions make sense, he's trying to prevent history to repeat itself.
He also is conscious about the fact that he actually hypnotizes the s classes he's nurturing and that's why at some point, he started to focus on beasts instead of humans.

Personally I'm more curious about kim seonghan, he totally disappeared!

(sorry this is so long lmao)

I mean, he has to be, but the issue I have with him is that he's portrayed as "very caring and overprotective" in such a good light that it overlooks the more interesting aspects of his personality ("manipulative, calculating and greedy as fuck"). He's defined by his circumstances and while it's effective at implying his personality, it's not effective at actually creating personality.

Like, take Light from DN. Although you can argue Light's transformed by events around him, he is at the forefront of his choices and so he forms himself and his personality is defined by him as a person and his choices. He is the one who chooses to use the death note, he is the person who chooses who to kill and by what standards - his choices make him and his choices creates his events.

HYJ is defined by the events around him. He is put into a situation and he reacts to it and from his reactions we can learn about his personality. It's not bad, it's just not effective for his personality. Manhwa do this a lot, and it's good for action stories, but imo as a person who likes characters more than plot, it's terrible for character realization. We don't really get a lot of HYJ's apprehensions or his personality because he only ever reacts and he's not proactive. For someone like him, who has a lot to unbundle, it's just weird to have it from the author's perspective because ofc he's going to be shown in a sort of clever and protective way when the things that fuel these things are a lot crueler manipulativeness and greed (as you said).

idk it's not a good set up for characters... and the author is either too lazy or just doesn't care since most people care for event-based plot in action (like look at jjk)...

Seonghan is precisely an example of why I find HYJ weird... His personality change is drastic and HYJ is not that bothered. He isn't unbothered, but he isn't guilty. There's a difference between being conscious and being guilty, and idk it seems like the author just ignores this point.

While I don't doubt he isn't guilty, it's just... the manhwa is too focus on action-based event and is ignoring character-based events, which are equally important and it makes the entire work a lot cheaper than it actually is.

That's not how his ability works and I'm limiting this to S-ranks directly under his influence because I have issues with the S-ranks that like him. But his ability literally states that if he says "I love you" to someone, they'll become more and more inline with the idea of being a nurturee aka HYJ DOES make people belove him and that includes the S-ranks. So, he IS hypnotizing people.

Secondly, they live in a world with skills. It's highly unusual for them to not be suspicious that he isn't afraid of them. So, they should be somewhat aware that he has a skill and they do to some extent.

Your point that they're thought of as nothing but monsters so they like him because he doesn't and that's love - that doesn't make sense. By that sense, they should be pretty close to each other because they don't think of each other as monsters, but they don't. They hate each other and are distrustful. Why are they distrustful? Because they are capable of ruining each other. The S-ranks are single-handedly the only people capable of killing S-ranks and that terrifies them to the point they are fairly hostile to each other. They are willing to collaborate but not by much. And this makes sense. They should hate each other.

But where does this leave HYJ? HYJ is someone who doesn't think of them as monsters, but he's fragile. As everyone says, a flick from HYH and he's dead. He is someone who isn't a threat to him. Of course, they bow and they listen and they are willing to bend their necks for him but when it comes down to it, they can kill him whenever they want. As much as he is described as being 'their owner' he is not. And that weakness is why I say they can't be in love. What the S-ranks feel for HYJ is safety. They can talk to him and befriend him rather freely and still feel safe because he isn't a threat to them. In this sense, you could call him the perfect nurturer. That isn't love... that's just some misplaced sense of comfort. They're alone, they're vulnerable in their own way, here's someone who can understand them without posing a threat, ofc they're going to 'love' him. It's disgusting... honestly... They don't treat HYJ as a human as much as the manhwa likes to overlook this fact, they treat him like a pet.

If your dog whimpers and pleads for his toy, you're going to give it the toy. If you cat scratches the bedpost, you'd get a little frustrated but then laugh it off. If your bird calls you at 4 am in the morning you'll be annoyed, but it's an animal and you oblige it. When you're bored, send your animal to an animal shelter. Your dog bites you too hard? Time to be put down. That's the relationship between the S-ranks that aren't skill'd and HYJ and that is NOT love.

If we're talking a relationship, that comes after they interact and get to know him and even then, that power imbalance is unhealthy. This is literally an entire unit in literature - power imbalances in relationships. How they affect people, how they manifest, common descriptions so on so forth... It's not love, and if you wanted to describe it as love, it's more of fondness and habit than love.

Future doesn't mean literal future.

It could mean your future as in your career prospects or your potential future. He can see the future of some people - it's just a prospective future. It's a fairly common way of using the word future in English...

Like, I could say you have a good future. Do I know your future? No. Have I seen you're future? No. But based on information you've given me, I can make assumptions for your future and that is what we mean when we compliment someone in having a good future.

Similarly, his skill doesn't see the precise future, but he sees their potential. As long as he can unlock their potential, that is their future and for that reason, I can say his skill is seeing the future especially considering you took it out of context when I said the "capability and the future of others..."

Oh i m not sure about that, at this point in the story he only acts for his own selfish purpose, i agree about the fact that it's made a lot more obvious and his bad traits are often shown as a comic relief, but the whole story basically exists for the fact that he couldn't stand to be alone after his baby brother died protecting him just because he was unable to see the bigger picture.

We can't really have a valid opinion about the whole saving the world thing at this point since we still don't know the truth behind the world destruction and only saw one side of the story.
But the rewind happened BECAUSE youjin wished for it, so i actually think that it's pretty well balanced. Shit happens and he reacts according his own standard then other shits happen, and he reacts again, he creates situations and deals with the consequences.

As fot death note,
Well first it's a funny comparison.
Because death note is a manga and the s class[°°°] is a manwha. Clearly koreans and japaneses have a very different way to tell stories. If this one was a manga, yoojin would already have destroyed half of the world he created by going back to the past, fucked all the dudes he hypnotized and become the villain.
And death note cannot really be compared, it's a story about fatality
Raito managed to obtain a great and destructive power and drowned in it to the point he forgot his initial goal, saw himself as a god and died miserably like a human by the hand of the god who gave him this power,

But so far, the S class seems most likely about hope,
how a tiny incompetent dude obtained half by chance and half by cleverness a power that could help him save the world if used right.
(But we will need the rest of rhe story to be sure lol)

I personally appreciate the fact that he's not all white or all black, and that the "hero" started shit for a very selfish and bad reason.
If i had to complain about something, he's maybe a little bit *too* smart and *too* pragmatic.

This is.... lnoger.... aha... I type really fast...

I've read part of the ln so I might just be more irritated because he's portrayed as a really good person and anything negative is as you said a joke or something rather superficial. The translation might have been at fault there (which was pretty bad) but he doesn't really change all that much (there is no full translation out...).

The issue I have is exactly with how his bad points are comic relief. It's fun and it's light hearted yeah, but some of his bad traits should not be fun or comic relief. Like, the matter of his skill being basically coercion, that is something, imo that should be really big. It should be constant and sort of mentioned throughout the manhwa but it really isn't... just occasional to the point that I have to realize it for myself and that's just... weird. Because it should bother someone a lot and it should get him really paranoid that if his skill ever wears off then they won't like him, but that's just not really addressed. Maybe it will be...? But even if it was, it'd be kind of late for that... honestly.

I swear, there was a better example of this, but I'm just not remembering it lmao...

Imo, with how the story is going on, it'll probably end up being something like HYJ was doomed to it and that it was something he would face regardless because he is in the perfect situation for it or something. Idk that's basically what they did with Solo Levelling and korean manhwa are not particularly famous for being various... I don't think it's a bad thing, it's just what else other than that? I mean, to you it's balanced, but over time, as events build up and there are more and more scenarios, he'll have less and less of an effect on his life. Which actually, is totally fine (there are a lot of manga/manhwa like that) if they had more things on his character and his impression rather than use it as comic relief, but they don't. And I don't know if they fix it, but from what I've seen not really? The only vaguely interesting part is when he doesn't have his fear-resistance skill and honestly, he just powers through and that's... ok...

The author should drop the comic relief as a method to overlook his negative traits and actually think about who he is writing and how it should affect someone. And not just that, there is literally a very easy way to fix this and it's just to show everything from someone's else's (a S-rank's perspective) for a duration of time and not just idk some comments from now and then but genuinely a flashback or something - even if a lot of people might hate it since it's not an action-pulling event, it's a solution (though not the best). But people hate it so it's not going to happen lmao.

idk it could just be that manhwas aren't as flexible. Because there are manhwas that focus on actions for a story (like cheese in the trap) and that's fine for cheese in the trap because 1. it's romance and romance is actually the most flexible thing to write ever 2. it's comprehensive in why something has been done and it isn't chalked up to as you said pragmatic choices. But with TSCIR it is chalked up to pragmatic choices, so the author limited himself into creating a pretty... tight niche... Though, if you compare with things like Solo Levelling, it's much better in terms of characters.

imo it's not that weird to compare two different manga/manhwas from different countries. It's like comparing 100 years of solitude to ms. dalloway which is completely viable and done fairly often... The point is that there are good points in ms dallway or good points in 100 YoS that could be brought into each other or are a feasible point of comparison.

It's not to say the good parts of DN can't be brought to TSCIR just because they're two different styles. Though you're right that LY is functionally a different character from HYJ... but imo it's that because all the choices that LY made are made by LY individually and are therefore well explained and um reacted to, we end up getting a lot more insight into what he does. It's a lot more balanced than HYJ and there are funny parts, but the author in DN doesn't make light of LY character because he is the antagonist and the protagonist (in a way) at the same time. So while it is easier for LY to become more ig balanced, HYJ suffers from the problem that LY succeeds in. If HYJ could become as uhh balanced as LY, he has to be forced into explaining his actions or at least giving a better reaction to the situation around him instead of the same placid reaction... every time.

Like when LY is in prison, um in that interval where he knew he was kira we get a lot of his um frustration as well as uhh happiness ig. He makes actions and he defines them, HYJ does neither of that later on and that's just... so... weird. idk if that makes sense.

And I would argue, that TSCIR can achieve the somewhat the same effect as DN even without just killing everyone and going hellbent on revenge. imo the reason why TSCIR even has this issue is because the author doesn't bother to explain HYJ or rather they never intended to do so in the first place. Which was why I compared the two as one leading actions and the other as being lead by actions. They just never really though about who they're writing just what they're writing. It's why isekai manga are so boring... and why baccano won a light novel competition. Of course you need action and it can't all be in your head, but the best works are ones where people are monologuing out what they're doing and the author is taking the time to work out everything. It's not popular now, but that's because most people are braindead half the time.

As for the perfectly competent and pragmatic genius... I've already come to the conclusion that most manhwa will always follow that pattern... It's not bad, it's just um like the Great Pretender, it's only interesting the first time it happens. It's repetitive and it only works in DN where your protagonist is your antagonist and even then, LY had to die.

... it's um really long

Yea i totally agree with you about manwha artists tending to choose the lazy way, which i find extremely sad, and i also more than agree about the part of the audience being braindead, and that's where internet is as much a curse as a bliss.
The first audience has way too much weight in the direction a story will take, i wish authors could write stories without having to take into account the opinion of close minded and dumb people, it disserves the authors, their works and most of the readers who will read later. And in the case of manwhas it's especially obvious. Even though I've read more BL than any other genre, i can see clearly the influence of the audience (and it fucking sucks), 98% of the books I've read were ruined because of that, I'm not really your basic 15yo baby fujoshi that craves smut and happy endings so it upsets me a lot.

I just started solo levelling so I can't really compare with this book (but the 25 first chapters gave me flashbacks of the vietnam of the evolution of mmorpgs -_- grinding is boring af omg i almost felt my keyboard under my fingers ><)

Now let's not fool ourselves, there's no way the author will put as much obvious topics of reflection as there are in death note, even though the plot seems deep and grave, the book is clearly a comedy (and I'm not complaining, i love comedies) and the audience won't let it become too serious. I'm not blaming the author, they have to bring food on the table huh, so they write what will sell.(and I'm reading it here, i dont even have the right anyways)

I think in the end, it's our role now to individually separate the good and bad sides of the MC, in order to let everybody enjoy the story the way they want to (did you see how many wished this was BL in the comments? XD)
Yes I'm trying to look pragmatic even though I'll come back and complain like a bitch in the comments when it will be completed x') but I'll still buy a few chapters, I laughed a lot and i really need it atm

And don't worry about the length, I'm french so it's a good way for me to learn English without it becoming a pain in my ass, and i love debating especially with people who have a different opinion (they rarely do tho)

help this is the issue with manhwas istg. Like sometimes there are manhwas that are really just trying things out so they mess some things up but the idea is really cool and they get bombed because they have so-so pacing. BUT LIKE compared to the regular stereotypical stories with the same plot and so on and so forth, I'd rather read something interesting. IMO, honestly, there are a lot of 'good' anime that aren't really that good, they're just so balanced that it seems really good, but when you think about it specifically, it's not that special or interesting or even that insightful.

ISTG there's this yaoi called Moritat and like, it has a 8.9 rating on mggo and that's really low (for yaoi on mggo) but it's actually pretty interesting and it only gets a little confusing because of how they organized it. There are people in the comments going like it's too confusing and the author wrote something about called radio storm which imo was worse and less interesting but it has a higher rating because it's less confusing. BUT LIKE LISTEN THESE TWO GUYS ARE JUST WALKING AROUND AND THE WORLD MAP DOES NOT MAKE ANY SENSE WHATSOEVER. Like, if they drove, I'd get it but they don't and people love it and I just... okay???

okok hear me out about solo levelling. It's actually not bad. It's just the first 90% of it sucks, but the overall plot is good and it's funny cause everyone hates the ending but when you get there, it's actually a good ending and would be completely acceptable in an anime because it's pretty common and idk they think it's intellectually better lmao, but manhwa readers are just so... okay. It's just Madoka ending atp... in a complicated way. It's not creative creative, but it's not bad bad. But some people hate the ending and you'll see why when you read it.

tbh I just wished that they stopped the subscription model as much as people seem to love it because we get a chapter a week not a volume every two months. I feel like that is somehting that's stopping authors from being able to do anything. When you compound something into a week, they have to think about every chapter and it's impact. omg, I read on ao3 and there are authors who have literally apologized for filler in the authors notes like we can't have one breathtaking scene after another, that's just not how stories work. There's a beginning, uh rising action, climax, falling action, resolution so on and I feel like this week-model makes authors forget. They have plans, but sometimes when you put pen to paper it breaks down, because they can't have filler for three straights chapters, that's three weeks of fillers people will give up. But if you have it by volume, you can pace yourself and you CAN have sometihng interesting happen per volume or something special or a cliffhanger. And it's this filler-blocker (...) that's forcing authors to put action and more action per chapter instead of per volume. Something HAS to happen every chapter instead of every volume and authors has to quickly run through everything... BUt like with death note, since readers can read a volume in a matter of a few hours, they can have what would amount of three weeks of filler and two weeks of action...

OK ngl I don't mind the level of shipping in TSCIR (cause I like ORV) and like male-male implications are always the best type of shounen ai if they aren't shounen ai. Like, idk if you've ever watched it, but Hannibal is a good example. It's good and I don't like it when the author needs to spend two entire chapters detailing how they have sex lmao.

It's like the author is leaving brainrot and some bits of other things sometimes... idk... it's okay to be comedic, but it just seems like a waste because there are so many of htese stories already and this one seemed somewhat better in theory than the rest and the author just decides to neglect it because he's afraid he can't write it well or something. Author nowadays are punished for writing interesting but poorly paced than boring and balanced works and its depressing. ofc a new author won't be able to master everything, but they need room to try at least.

ohh lmao okok that's good ig. ╮(￣▽￣)╭ your english is great though (it's better than my french for sure hahaha...)

Um, from the anime, it was Atsushi and Akutagawa who fought the God.

then who dealt with Dostoevsky

and didn't the anime diverge from the manga. I didn't watch it because someone told me it diverges.

It doesn't diverge as far as we know idk who told you that but it'll only diverge if atsushi and aku don't end up fighting that God and the manga isn't that far yet

When the anime was released it was actually ahead of the manga. The anime ended when Akutagawa and Atsushi face the god Fukuchi and was about to battle it. It was an open ended, epilogue.

The ANIME, still follows the manga so it's still a valid source. Better watch it for yourself. Chuuya and Dazai won't be able to fight it cuz they are in England and the events in the airport happened in Japan.

huh I guess they switch.

So Atsushi and Akutagawa handle Dostoevsky and Fukuchi ver 2.

idk someone told me that Fukuchi dies by Teruka on the anime.

okok i have reserves about Akutagawa fighting with Atsushi but ok. thanks for telling me- I honestly hoped Dazai could die against Dostoevsky and vice versa because it would make sense given he's his equal to some extent... but ＼(`Δ’)／

(I am that small majority that find bsd anime really uncomfortable to watch- and ngl my impression of bsd is miracles happen everywhere. They have an ability user that can stop time for a few secs, they can find one that teleports-)

He does die but didn't he revive as a god just now? That's probably the god we see aku and atsu fighting in the anime's epilogue. In conclusion you're right about him dying but wrong about the diversion as far as we know

I said I was told Teruka killed him, but in the manga Dostoevsky kills him. That's the difference I was talking about... not sure how true that is cause my friend was the one who told me (⊙…⊙ ) idk I just don't like how asagiri punches his way through his problems.

Bro wdym teruka killed him in manga too

No, Dostoevsky threatened Fukuzawa with his death. He was twitching.

Bro read chapter 144.5 - he says, I'd advise you not to move. I won't hesitate to kill him. Then Fukuchi says Pay it no mind, strike him down, and then please teruka-kun you must cue everyone trying to stop Dostoevsky and THEN Dostoevsky stabbed him with the holy sword and then the space time sword.

THEN he died and THEN he revived.

I have a good memory of these things and I was sure Dosteovsky killed Fukuchi.

Yes, Teruka stabbed Fukuchi, but that doesn't mean he died...

Yeah you're right but that part is not shown in the anime so we're assuming (in the anime) that teruko killed fukuchi by stabbing him. Since the part with dostoevsky and Bram is not animated it's the same with manga upto that point cuz the anime is behind the manga now.

ohhh--- (⊙…⊙ ) thats such a great way to end... the one important piece left out. okok thanks for replying to my weird responses this entire time--

It's fine ╮(￣▽￣)╭