Plumy's Topics (44)

Uhm I dont see enough of that to say that his sexuality came from his trauma. Ian definitely has lots of trauma being an ex addict and a murder but I don't think that is the reason he sleeps with men. Ian is definitely promiscuous but I wouldn't say he's hyper sexual or that he uses sex with men to cope. I perceive Ian to just be a gay man who happens to have trauma and I haven't seen anything that would make me believe that if he didn't have that trauma that he would most likely be with a woman. Or maybe I missed a flashback or something???

I definitely feel like that started it though. Time may have changed the intensity of the trauma but I feel that he wouldn’t have had sex if it wasn’t for his trauma from being raped/sa’ed.

I mean unless he is said to be gay before the SA, sure. But I definitely feel like his trauma led him to having sex with TJ and other men. I don’t think his sexuality came from his trauma because I do think he genuinely fell for TJ, but the sleeping around, maybe. It’s not too uncommon for SA victims to react this way.

Ian use to date women, which is why tj never proceed to to deepen their relationship in the beginning and Ian knew of tj feels but never lead with it until after his truma and killing of david. Ian could've been curious about his sexuality before his assault but you can't deny that it didn't somehow contribute to it. I never said he was hyper sexual but yes he does sleep with men to cope, at least with his insomnia which he has confirm to Jo.

Most I got is from the raws but the 2 currently translated flashbacks kinda put some sense to what I read in the raws.

Idk if im missing something but didn't he sleep with men before the rape? He was egging TJ on by asking if he wanted to try it like the others guys did when he was on drugs and TJ was holding him down. Wasnt that before the SA?? And yeah Ian is a little thotty but no more thotty then the average adult man lol straight or gay. I do think he was having a lot of sex during his drug use days but the drugs definitely influenced that.

And I've read the raws but obviously I can't

Understand the raws.

Haha lol no worries. I honestly don’t remember so I can’t say much. If he did sleep before trauma, then this def got nothing to do with his trauma.

Currently from what I remember no he hasn't slept with men before the rape. Him egging tj on was after it which is why he's egging him on because Ian notices the way tj looks at him the way other men look at him. Currently there's no indication he slept with men before the rape at the moment.

I think the story will progress quickly and end soon bcs the timeline is been 11 years omg =))) so many things happened or maybe the author will going to explain to each person what going on in their life in the last 11 years and then we'll see the love arc

if only i could give this comment a thousand likes

that makes no sense girl tj also knows how to read ian, he's known him since they were teens what does this comment even mean no hate fr

“Difference is the time of knowing each other and despite the time of knowing, Jo is able to read Ian more clearly in that short amount of time.”

Ouch!

An yet he still lack to see want Ian really wants and keeps Ian from achieving it. They knew each other since teens but despite it, their relationship hasn't progressed in years.

lol did you read the story?? tj knows exactly what ian wants, and yeah he did stop him bc he's obsessed but now tj let ian go so idk why you're complaining. again, their relationship hasn't progressed not bc "tj can't see what ian wants" it's bc they literally cannot be together for the reasons mentioned in the story please read my god

tj never let Ian go and he doesn’t plan to anytime soon, now are you sure you're reading the story? If you're talking about him walking away, yeah no, he know Ian will come back to him and he uses that to his advantage. Also he doesn't know exactly what Ian wants and if he did, he seems to not care at all about it. It's a partial reason. The main reason is tj himself being selfish and acting like it's a selfless act and quilting tripping Ian which he confirms himself he's doing.

What are you even talking about. This chapter is about Tj and Ian's relationship before they were messed up by mr Jang and David Kim. I don't know what the hell Jo has to do with any of this.

What makes you think I'm even talking about a certain chapter? This is a comment section and that doesn't equal all comments are even about the newest update. Fyi I read the flashbacks their relationship was mess up due to tj himself as well.

they're a bunch of hypocrites for real lol

hopefully this manhwa show how different jo handles his possessive thoughts about ian compared to tj, hope he doesn’t become tj 2.0 as if one is not menacing enough

Agreed. The author is showing that both do have extreme flaws but is protraying the difference in reaction of both ML's obsessive love as both are quite opposite of each other. There's bound to be parallels between them as well.

i’m sure there will be, we haven’t even reached the conflict part where jo getting involved with the gang drama

Jo is the one trying to prevent Ian from seeing TJ tho. TJ left them alone when he saw them together. And TJ is fine with Ian fucking other guys, Jo isn't. TJ never purposefully cut anyone out of Ian's life, he was simply the only one to stay with him willingly and even felt guilty about being happy about that.

as if ian want to fuck other guys out of fun, he does that so he can tire himself to sleep at night, all jo said was “don’t toy with ppl’s feelings like that” and ian take that into consideration and actually did it WITHOUT jo forcing him to, even jo asked him why he hasn’t been sleeping around lately, and this change is A GOOD THING for ian. also let’s not act like jo doesn’t feel bad for preventing ian to talk with tj, he said it to himself “i’m not as good as you thought i am” yes first it was out of jealousy but then he saw ian fresh from crying and can’t stop thinking “what happened that day?” jo ain’t no saint but he’s DEFINITELY the better choice for ian than TJ

Thank you.

Didn’t they also try to justify him indirectly hurting Ian? I don’t think I’ve seen ONE TJ Stan on Twitter admit how TJ indirectly hurt Ian—emotionally and physically.

We're not talking about what Ian gets from the other guys, we're talking about TJ and Jo's reactions.
Jo's been creepy and manipulative about Ian. He's been reacting weirdly to TJ calling Ian before he even knew the guy. He's been jealous since the /beginning/ when he barely got to know Ian. He immediately starts asking invasive questions like "Then what about someone you liked...". "Does that guy come by often?" "Most? Most are cool?" and then he clenches his jaw and gets weird. He gets rejected and goes "This has never happened to me before and I'm not sure what to do". He gets upset because he's "not that close" or didn't know sth about Ian after seeing him literally a couple of times. "He probably slept with that guy, too... I wonder for how long..." and then a panel of him looking pensive. "I'm definitely not going to tell him that guy stopped by" but then when TJ disappears he talks about it all of a sudden and changes the topic when he doesn't get the reaction he wanted. "[...] people can't help but stare at him. It's pissing me off-", he can't stand people even /looking/ at Ian and at that point they're not even close to being together. He literally gets a gun, zones out and leaves his childhood home early to go confess. The whole confession and sex scene are weird for me too, but that might be just me. "How great would it be if he was mine forever?" And he's the one having a dream about another guy fucking Ian, telling him "I've been inside him so many times...", then hovers creepily over Ian and makes a hickey where the other guy kissed Ian in the dream. He's obsessing over "Who he met and what he did...", "It makes me angry". He's even creepy about the Chris situation? And Chris is actually scared of him. He literally just ignored Ian, used his body and fulfilled his own fantasy without consent. "Don't do this with anyone else. Only do it with me from now on-"
Yeah, Ian stopped sleeping around on his own. It doesn't make Jo constantly thinking about it any less weird. And he didn't do it after the "don't toy with people's feelings", he did it after TJ disappeared and they started spending more time together. And I don't get your "even jo asked him" like it's a good thing. The "What do you mean it's been a while...?" "Really? Why...?" is... weird, he's not surprised, he's prying. And he gets ridiculously excited and /pushy/ when he's told that it's because of him, because Ian considered his feelings.
I don't know why you think he feels bad. The "I’m not as good as you thought i am" is one of the biggest red flags and he doesn't look even a bit remorseful in that panel. He looks /determined/, it's literally after he admits to himself "[...] am I being posessive? [...] Does that mean that this feeling is dangerous? I definitely can't say it's pure. [...] it doesn't matter. [...] I know clearly what it is that I want", he's willing to be manipulative because he's going after what he wants. He went with the "Don't dismiss that consideration of his", using TJ's "consideration" for his own gain. Earlier he would catch himself on his weird behaviour and go "What am I thinking?", he doesn't anymore because he's okay with it.
He /wanted/ to prevent them from meeting. He was waiting for Ian (lied about that too), saw Ian running after TJ and /sprung/ to action. There's literally a huge red-colored panel that certainly doesn't scream innocent intentions. He sees TJ, has a calculated (imo crazed) look and desperately calls Ian's name and then catches his hand when Ian doesn't stop.
While TJ distanced himself since their fight all the way back in season 1. He had some revelations after the accident and told Ian to stay away and stayed away himself.
They're both posessive and TJ had a couple of creepy moments at the start, but the further we go and more we know, his seem more justified, while Jo only gets weirder. I'm not saying Jo's doing it to purposefully hurt Ian or that he's doing it by force but he is manipulative and he aims to get Ian for himself. He believes himself to be justified, that's one of the problems.

“ He believes himself to be justified, that's one of the problems” —Now I don’t think he thinks that. He knows what he’s doing is wrong and is self aware.

“ TJ had a couple of creepy moments at the start, but the further we go and more we know, his seem more justified” — What things that he did are justified?

Also I ageee that Jo is getting more obsessive/possessive.

I should probably stop using the word 'justified', huh? sksk maybe idk how to use it well

Ah no, yeah, he thinks he's "not kind" etc. but he 'wants well' for Ian. He believes he's 'good for Ian'. Or that TJ is 'bad for Ian' even tho he barely knows them and anything about their relationship.

There are moments that seem creepy but then start making sense. I mostly remember things from the raws now tho since there was a lot of backstory lately. Like him getting mad over the name David Kim seems more reasonable. Or he had a whole internal monologue about how he trapped Ian with guilt a while ago but the scene actually shows him trying to be considerate and not like it was his conscious decision to make Ian feel indebted. It might be that he didn't even think about it that way until Ian used his own words when he got his leg broken. Or the flashback where TJ said "So now... it's really just the two of us left" was already shown and seemed weird then but in context he's feeling conflicted about it, guilty about being happy that they're close because Ian is in a bad spot. Once again, he didn't cause that, he was simply the only one who remained by Ian's side while others cut him out. They were friends while Ian had other friends and girlfriends before. TJ tried to help Ian, he didn't try to take advantage of him. There's also a theory on why he didn't like Jo from the beginning that seems plausible to me. From the older ones, the scene where Ian's leg was shattered was chapter 17 but when we got a depiction of TJ's trauma in chapter 26 it made more sense. I said "seem more justified" because while they're still there, the scenes don't seem as ominous or creepy as they did before, they're easier to understand.
On the other hand the scene where Jo prevents Ian from talking with TJ seemed innocent at first and just got revealed as Jo being possessive and manipulating the situation.
It's like the more insight we get, the more we get of TJ's 'good' side and Jo's 'bad' side.

Yin Yang shit. And honestly I’m kinda not too surprised that Jo has become possessive although I don’t see why he’s so into Ian despite knowing him for a few months or less (I don’t remember but it’s short time).

We can be mad that he’s kinda stepping between TJ and Ian, but that is part of the story. Without Jo’s intervention, I doubt the story would’ve started or progressed, I think the author is going that way. Otherwise she would’ve just started it off with Ian and TJ rather than focusing on Jo mostly and Ian. And then we see TJ and Ian’s backstory.

With the Orion and Hunter story theory, all main leads are involved and play a role. So we can be mad, sad, but all is part of story and one can’t progress without the other in my opinion.

And I’m just frustrated that some people are actually mad at Ian for sleeping around. That isn’t even an issue nor problematic. Both male leads know he’s doing that. Jo isn’t okay with it clearly but he and Ian have not established any relationship nor w TJ.

I’m sure TJ feels remorse for some of his indirect harm to Ian. That’s why he’s redeemable in my opinion. There hasn’t been any of those common stuff like “rape” “Uke being constantly assaulted”, if I remember correctly.

While I agree that TJ tries to help, he focuses on the gang life a lot and Ian doesn’t have the same priority as him. I think TJ is doing this all to somehow protect Ian but he doesn’t realize Ian is hurting and is on the edge every time he feels like the other is going away.

I do think TJ took some sort of advantage of Ian’s guilt for him. It was even said in one of the chapters (below ch 30 I think or less). BUT that doesn’t mean I hate him, he knows what he was doing and was guilty for that. I don’t hate any of the characters right now. Do I dislike what they did? Yeah. Are they irredeemable? Nope!

Compared to other MLs from other stories, TJ and Jo are on the calmer side…and for Jo specifically, hopefully he stops manipulating cause that shit isn’t it…although it adds more drama to story and I do enjoy it, it can’t be a forever thing.

Same, that’s one of the things that made me wary of him since the beginning.
Yeah, the story needs all of them, they’re all driving it forward, leading other characters to grow. It’s about all three of them and their relationships. They also all have their flaws. The author is crafting the story really well. And it’s one that kind of needs to be reread to wholly grasp it.
Yes! The comments are vicious about Ian. The slutshaming is atrocious.
Nah, their relationship is wholly consensual, they just made a mess out of it because of the circumstances and by being codependent and emotionally constipated. They both try to protect the other and both feel guilty and make it even more complicated. As Ian said they’re “going in circles” but are also unable to let each other go.
I think that’s the moment I was talking about. He probably leans on it, thinks that’s the only reason why Ian is still with him. But it’s not like he manipulated Ian into it and we haven’t seen him bring it up either. And even then he feels bad about it.
Overall: yeah, I agree.

I've been looking at some chapters and it reminded me of something.
It seems like Ian became numb to killing (”I don't feel anything... Should I feel something? (Words like "unconditionally" and "for each other" were just my arrogance.) This isn't normal unless something's broken.”). I think TJ is worried about that. Like when Ian says “I’m gonna kill them all”. Imo it might have something with why he let Ian go to prison but that’s just my theory. And TJ seems to be having doubts? “What exactly... have I been doing this for... all this time?” - since he’s been doing everything for Ian but it doesn’t make him better off? And I might have also missed something but do we know what Jason promised TJ? The promise he said he can’t keep that TJ’s been worried about.

Also Ian doesn’t want to let TJ go. There were already signs of it since the beginning but there’s only more and more of them. At first it could seem like TJ was more obsessed with Ian (a red flag if you will haha), but Ian is just as obsessed with him. The relationship was portrayed as more one-sided when the story started but with time it became clear that it’s not. Ian is the one who always says that he’ll go away but never does ("Asking 'why don't you go abroad...' what a useless question" with TJ's smile as the background, always answering "When are you leaving?" with "I'm not sure", and he was supposed to go away when he gets the money after Jason’s death but instead he came to the funeral to say ‘TJ you need me’). And even if he would leave it would be for TJ, he thinks /he’s/ ruining TJ and TJ’s life ("That'll be enough time for him, too", "I knew everyone I love eventually becomes miserable", “How much longer am I going to be selfish…?”, I think there was also sth along the lines of ‘it’s my fault’ somewhere). He's the one leaving things at TJ’s place, sth people do to have a reason to come back. He had a breakdown and started looking for TJ “Is this what I really wanted?” immediately after their fight. He waited for TJ to call him. He went “I’m gonna kill them all” and showed up at the funeral with “It’s not like we only have today”. He even forgot that TJ /can/ leave him, “If there’s one thing I overlooked that day, it’s the fact that you also had a choice, not just me. And just like that, Oh Taejoon disappeared without a word. Oh Taejoon… Where are you?”. “Is he determined to bear the burden of everything? All by himself? After badgering me over and over saying he needs me and that he wanted me to come back, why is he doing this now…?!”. Ian is looking for TJ, hiring someone to dig up information, going constantly to their favorite places (”I have been coming around here too much lately”). “Maybe you really decided to let me go. And this might actually be the end of us.” - he doesn’t seem happy about that. And even when he leaves the burger place it's 'for TJ's sake' - “I better lay low even more instead of poking around for nothing. That’ll be the best thing for Oh Taejoon too. I’m only a nuisance to his plans right now anyways”.
So what I'm saying is... now we really can’t say that Ian is 'trying to run away from TJ' like lots of people did in the beginning and still do. People are stuck on that first impression of a one-sided obsessive relationship.

Sorry if I'm spamming you sksk it's just it's been great discussing it with you and I have a lot of thoughts

You read nice and enjoy analyzing I see. All I think is that what you described is an unhealthy codependent relationship mixed with unresolved traumas and feelings. This is something needed to be solved before they reach somewhat of a story conclusion.

They’re constantly thinking of each other and while that may sound nice, it’s really codependent and sad.

Yup! It is. I'm not saying it's not, it totally is. It's just not a one-sided relationship - TJ being the only one chasing Ian and Ian trying to run away. Maybe they're breaking the cycle now with TJ refusing Ian's help, or maybe they're just doing the same as before with TJ 'protecting Ian', we'll see.

I don’t think it’s a one sided relationship but it’ll remain a codependent relationship which is personally worse than one sided love. Codependent isn’t healthy one bit. Maybe they are going to break the cycle. It’ll involve all main characters for sure, one can’t progress without the other, Vice versa.

omg speak on it. I've given up on trying to look at what people are saying on twitter when it comes to Wet Sand. it's genuinely so bad

I agree. I think this was largely influenced by his likeability. In the beginning he had a more sinister vibe which was thrown out of the plot to maintain his popularity and general popularity of the manhwa but that just ended up ruining his character and role in the plot as it was originally intended. For the most part he feels like filler material than a well though out part of the plot. The author tries to make him important but so much of his character arc is so out of place with the main plot. Eventually he is only left as the nice guy down bad for a man that doesn't want him.

Even though he couldn't convey what he wanted but as he said he doesn't want to make his readers sad who wanted happy ending with JY. So ig it's fine. Love won in the end.