Brainebot

I'm not surprised to see you lean more towards TJ cause most love triangles end with the red flag being the endgame. We often seeing the decent guy changing the MC's life to better just so he can go back to his past toxic relationship. The involvement of the third guy always surprisingly make the other two realise their true feelings for each other. If that happens in this story I wouldn't be surprised.

Also, sex is one of the main factors to hint the endgame. So you can tell who has the most intense, detailed and long sex with Ian.

Tbh I’m moreso hoping for an endgame that sees all characters grow and progress. Both TJ and Ian have done terrible things and have unfortunate pasts so Id like an ending that sees them both fully move beyond that. One where Ian just goes back to a toxic relationship would be such a waste. As for Jo, Id also like to see how/ if he’s able to hold on to his goodness despite his being suddenly intertwined in their world. I think character evolutions like these are pretty interesting in stories like this so my reason for liking TJ slightly more is unrelated to the typical triangle archetype and is solely due to their dynamic and the emotional weight of their relationship. If I wanted a toxic love story I’d read one from the plethora of badly written stories that exist on here

Like I said I wouldn't be surprised if he ends up being the endgame cause we have seen enough of these scenarios.

Bro has everything that screams endgame meanwhile the good guy no comment.

Drop it then, no one is forcing you tho

Already did. And I’m leaving a comment because idk if you heard but that’s what comment sections are for. If you’re so offended by my not liking assault as a plot device though you’re free to just ignore this comment and move along

I totally feel you. I'm gonna hold on and just erase the sexual assault from my memory because it does NOT server any purpose at all, but I'm still interested in the characters. I agree that it does feel cheap and it's strange that author would wait until season2 to include something like this. I'm hoping there will be horrible regret and self-hate from Whats-his-face-rapist, but only time will tell ┗( T﹏T )┛

Wait who was sexually assaulted

Matthew, he got roofied and the girl was taking advantage of him

No, I think original post was specifically referring to the most recent chs (~48-49) [SPOILERS] where Matthew basically r***s other guy (forgot name).

This is always the point I make but people just act like it's not gross how they fetishize GAY guys like wtf is wrong with you if you do, some people do not know how to not cross that line and it's so fuxked up

Dude, Jin has a record of kills. He's in a gang and sells drugs. If you want to bring morality in this story SA is the least of your problems. Matthew is high on drugs and is hallucinating, how do you expect him to act?

And you really wanna bring fetishizing gay guys? Really? In the world of BL? You're read about a story that fetishizes gay dudes since ch1.

No it becomes a problem when sa is okay in BL just because it's BL doesn't justify any time of rape or straight scenes, because then people try to bring it irl and act on it that's my problem with it, gay and bi are different and people irl try to make it the same

Sooo just like how it's okay for a main characters to sell drugs? Like it's okay for someone from a gang to lure in and have sex with someone from college? Like how Matthew beat those guards to close death because he wanted to see Jin? You can find this setting/trope normalized anywhere in BL dude. There's literally no difference from me going to sell drugs and try to have sex with a college student if I kust tead the story then if you wanna apply your way of logic.

If you're reading, you should be able to at least separate reality from fiction. The mature rating is there for a reason. If you can't consume fiction without it affecting your morals, then you shouldn't even be consuming it in the first place.

It should but it doesn't to people, you ever think morals and stuff exist for a reason, and people were OK with Matthew being raped by a women why? Cause it was a women, fetishism, doesn't make it right ewp wince it had drugs in this system if a girl were to claim as Matthew people then would have Sympathy

Esp*

"It should but it doesn't to people" and the same rule applies to SA. If you're trying to argue against one crime in this fictional story at least commit to it instead of ruling and singling one out, otherwise it's just hypocritical.

Why are y’all so okay with authors continuously doing this trope? It doesn’t get tiring?

Exactly

No it’s not; they’re talking about the overarching problem in the community which is the abundance of unnecessary extremely graphic rape scenes that serve no purpose. This is not only in terms of this SINGLE webtoon but many, way too many mangas. You’re trying to be funny and trying to make their point in regards to this manga alone and that shit is dead weird because you know what they’re talking about. What is so wrong with advocating against it? You are so desensitized to rape in media that you’re willing to just see it as a common trope when it shouldn’t be when it serves absolutely nothing to the plot and is only used as straight porn. Like??? You don’t see how crazy it is they so many have rape in their plots

If a straight manga were to have a rape scene would you continue to make your same arugment or would it be okay ?

Also Gay rape is fetishized because whenever a man comes out and says he was, women act like it never happens irl male or female

Again, just cause rape is a common trope (lately), doesn't diminish other crimes that are used in the story just for the sake of "plot." If you're trying to argue rape being commonly used, the same can be said about other crimes that are used with no consequence yet literally 0 people complain them.

Complaining about why rape is in media is equivalent to why murder, crime, unnecessary violence is in media. We see these tropes normalized DAILY.

And no, I don't see it an issue of rape being used as a device in FICTION. I know right from wrong. I'm old enough to know that rape doesn't depict to reality. I treat it as senseless porn. If the rape portion in the story is too much, I skip it, move on. The author has free reign to draw whatever they want, and just cause they draw it, doesn't mean they support it.

Also what are you even trying to say here ??? with comparing woman rape to men rape. The chapter isn't even out yet. How do you get the message that this author is degrading men being raped compared to woman from those chapters cause last I checked, there was no mention of any woman in Korean. You just said above that readers can tell right from wrong so stop pushing a narrative that was never there in the first place.

You mean a man not being raped by a women, it wasn't in the manga or fetishized, I made all my points, you just ignored them to keep stories like this going, you know at some point there won't be any readable stories and it sure as hell won't be on me when that happens

Stop acting like your ate when you just ignored my points lmaooo

You*

Stop acting like you ate when you just ignored my point lmaoo

Sorry I didn't realize you weren't for it I just thought you were like the other person commenting, sorry

Here I am trying to help you? Everybody is L mans

What provoked you to say that? Why would you think women don’t take male rape seriously and even if that were true it would be so because its normalized

Oh aight

I was more focused on Matthew struggling with his depression and hoping he's able to come to his sense when she roofied him and you're thinking that scene with him with some rando girl trying to have sex when he's high is sexual and fetishized? Sounds like a "You" problem honestly.

You were but I don't believe that it can be the story if it's not useful in the plot and it's not it's just there so people can act like it doesn't happen, and it is a me problem because people don't like the truth, but the truth is when there are no more good stories do to useless porn in there, then it'll become a problem for you but for superficial reasons, people don't wanna say somethings wrong with a story when something actually is so yes and I won't change my mind

People were glorifying the women who was about to grape Matthew in the comments were unnecessary and gross

What is the goal of your argument? We’re arguing that use of rape in yaois lately isn’t necessary because it’s becoming normalized and fetishized. What I’m getting from you is that you’re saying that this topic doesn’t matter.

It's exactly that. You're trying to argue against something as criminal as rape yet you ignore and normalize all the other red flag behaviors throughout the story? What makes Matthew blunging guards to near death just to see Jin any normal from a girl trying to SA Matthew by drugging him? Jin is out here selling drugs and it's normalized seeing how he's not in jail yet no one had pointed that out at all. This trope is literally used in so many mafia BL and yet all people are pointing out is the rape in this story when it isn't even a significant part of the story so why make such a big deal about it?

Rape in BL is always written for mature audiences, not kids whether its written for porn or trope. Why would your first thought after viewing a rape scene be "wow so this author is saying rape is normal"

If you can't read mature fiction without it affecting your morals then why consume it in the first place?

What I’m saying isn’t contingent on those sole story; it’s a common theme in many stories. And even if those have other criminal activity why are you upset that I choose to target rape? You’re big mad I’m not talking about the gang related activity but that’s not a common theme in yaoi. You’re saying MAFIA bl. I said bl overall and above all things why are you saying normalizing those other behaviors? I’m not the author nor the artist nor have I said anything pertaining to normalizing it. What you’re communicating is that I should be advocating against all taboo / unjust activity otherwise it would be hypocritical and that makes no sense and I don’t know why this point keeps slipping past you. These drug and mafia tropes are not overarching in yaoi. RAPE is; that is why I said it.

My thought when I see these scenes constantly (in which they end up together) is, is this trope necessary and what does this communicate to the readers who consistently see this type of media in which there is no consequence to the rapist because it’s not seen as rape but a device that moves their love story forward?

And my morals are not conflicted by these scenes I am concerned about the message being communicated when rape is only used as a device without actually taking into account that rape is a complex issue and not just a quick porn scene to keep the audience engaged.

So without the other themes of drugs and the mafia because those are not overarching themes, why then is it so wrong to be upset with the consistent use of rape? Because even if you were correct and drugs and the mafia were constant themes why cannot focus on one argument? Why do I need to advocate 3 million points to communicate that there’s SOMETHING to be concerned about? Why can I not put emphasis on one point without being seen as hypocrital especially as I haven’t advocated for those or said they’re okay. But for your sake just know the mafia and drugs are necessary for THIS story. Because the main character is a part of it so it makes sense.

But let’s say you’re correct and drugs and the mafia and the other abuse are overarching. Then I agree that those being common themes are concerning.

Now what? What’s your point?

What I’m seeing on this website ever since the comments have been turned on are two groups of people. One being those who complain about these themes and those who complain about them. The first group from my perspective wants the over abundance of rape in this media to be diminished unless it’s crucial to the plot because the portrayal of it is detrimental not only in the normalization of it but it takes away from the complexity of the issue. The second argues it was never that deep and that they cannot argue because they’re here anyways so they’re hypocritical.

Jinx for instance, the use of rape in that story only serves as a device to show that the seme is closed off, aggressive, misunderstood whatever you want to call it. In which there uke doesn’t exhibit ptsd, guilt or shame or whatever other characteristics associated with rape victims because rape is not portrayed as rape in these stories but only a device and that is why it’s so concerned. By only portraying it as a device to push the story with no substantial affect then it dilutes the complexity of the issue and in turn even if unintentionally people start to normalize it because they’re not recognizing it for what it is.

A cruel god reigns is another example, rape was necessary to the plot because it portrayed a boy being molested and his psychological downfall from there. From reading that people are able to understand why victims don’t come forward, their guilt and shame, dynamics that come into play or even signs from rapists and victims. They can see the complexity of the issue but that is lost when authors just want to use it as a device to show the purity of their characters and (I say that because they mostly have their ukes say no since they’re the feminine one of duo and many authors want to maintain purity culture despite literally illustrating porn) smut.

The point is, depictions of rape matter because even if you say people can decipher their own moral compasses from specific media which is fine that’s true. But we cannot deny the IMPLICATIONS of that media if it’s portrayed in a specific manner as I said and we also cannot manage how people consume it or understand the media. People can read it and not understand that this is portrayed this way BECAUSE of purity culture or that these are not the typically behaviors of a victim because the author does not want to portray them as a victim. But at the end of the day they still are. And I can go off on that as well but this is already lengthy as it is.

All I’m saying is that this is concerning because we cannot manage how somebody consumes media and understands it. But we CAN discuss if its portrayed correctly and I say this to ask, of the second group of people do yall ever just wonder what if we all were just like, hey this rape trope shit is getting out of hand, and so authors just stopped depicting it so? Because authors know what we want. They know they have a bunch of young impressionable fujoshis that just want to see BL and smut so they don’t care about the implications. But they have an affect believe me they do. Even if you say it’s mean for mature people so they should be the only ones reading it, but we cannot manage who reads what or their level of maturity.

For instance in the US some of the statistics of violence towards women from men is attributed to the portrayal of women in porn and aggressive behaviors by the men. And this carries on in their mentalities because it’s normalized when they’re young. You think it’s different because this is just manga but it’s not. I’m not saying that this will increase violence or anything like that I’m just saying this kind of stuff and rhetoric overall this shit has an affect and it’s real concerning.

That’s my two cents. This is real long so idec if you read this or not but to somebody does I hope you understand what I’m trying to communicate.

Need to know why you’re riding so hard to defend a harmful trope? Like you don’t feel weird being pro SA scenes? There’s nothing mature about how such scenes are handled/ implemented in these stories? They don’t bring these up to serve some grand purpose or world build they just do it to fetishize the subjects/ perpetrators of the act. If not they wouldn’t draw the scenes the way they do. They would focus on the victim and not spend multiple panels giving different angles to appeal to the horny readers. Like stop acting dense, if you like it that much enjoy it silently and don’t act like it’s a masterful way to develop ‘mature’ plots I promise you anyone can tell you either have bad taste in fiction or just don’t want to admit you condone all the depravity