more interesting than the main pairing imho. I really wanna know what their arrangement is like and whether or not they actually have feelings for each other? Geumsun's words and tying 704's wrist with the mask he knew 704 has to wear regularly give me the vibes that he might like 704 but in a twisted possessive way.. I might be wrong though(lol)
And i wanna know what happened between 704 and San in the past as well
Yup, and since they're already having sex hahahaha
But the main still interests me.
lol that might be true. though tbh i think its just because of my tastes. of course i'm not saying the main pairing is not interesting at all but i just really like complicated love hate relationshipლ(´ڡ`ლ)
Their relationship might have problems sometimes but they're teenagers, and they're both boys, its normal to play fight. I don't like when people call their relationship toxic because clearly they started off on the wrong footing and slowly started caring for each other.
Remember when Guanshan really didn't feel comfortable (when Tian kissed him), he can ignore Tian and Tian also stopped seeing him. It was after Tian helped Guanshan that they made up and their relationship goes back to normal. I think when push comes to shove Guanshan is not a pushover and Tian is definitely not a rapist
Totally agree with you
He Tian is fucking scary and manipulative. I enjoy the story, but irl there would be no way in hell that you'd consider this "play fight" if someone did this to, say, a friend of yours.
i don't think he's manipulative actually he's pretty straightforward scary, and like i said they started off as enemies. but after what happened with She Li i think they're friends of some sort now
I do too. I was on the verge of dropping 19 Days before Mo came along. I just prefer tsunderes, delinquents, odd couples, bickering couples, rough housing over pure lovey dovey childhood friends. They just entertain me more and overall their relationship is more of a challenge. People keep coming here harping on realism, how they hope our real relationships aren't like this, and being so transparent. Sorry sis I still prefer them over Zhan and Jian Yi. I'm more entertained and when I'm reading a piece of fiction that's all I ask for. ╮(￣▽￣)╭ I didn't come here for an authentic healthy gay documentary. I want to see a cranky tsundere delinquent relentlessly and crazily chased by a rich popular pretty boy who for once is being rejected hard and by someone who (socially) is considered below him. It's just a joy for me to see how He Tian steps up his game next. How more outrageous will he be next?
idk if somethings wrong with my tastes but goddamn Rin's non human(?) form is hot (lol)
( ° ʖ °)
i just want Jay to be happy he's so cute and so pure and he's so easily pleased by everything Daniel does, everytime i see him he reminds me of a cute little puppy :(((
i know he'd probably end up with Taku but i like Joowon so much, god. i don't even know why. i hope the author gives him another bf if Haesoo left him(lol)
RIGHT? i usually hate asshole characters but here I am, charmed by joowon lmaooo. i think it's the fact that he's also paradoxically sweet and clingy. and he just reminds me of a puppy honestly. but it looks like taku is endgame? i'm enjoying the story either way! just a lot of SLS for me lol.
Omg same i like Jowoon so much
am i the only one who already felt bad for Sangwoo ever since we learnt what his mother did to him? dude was abused, raped and couldn't tell anyone about it bc they would arrest him for "killing" his parents. he was a cute kid up until she went batshit crazy on him and made him crazy too
yep. but by law, your crime is yours. You will have to serve your time, no matter your back story. Karma caught up to him
idk maybe i'm too soft on him but he was just too pitiful i don't have the heart to wish him that kind of painful death. i had wanted for him to at least get some peace before his death, because i know happiness is impossible for him, he never really learnt the concept
i guess its just called a cursed fate. Never knowing happiness and extending that to his own twisted killings.That was his curse and his burden to bear. He took it upon his own hands to murder. Its quite sad and poetic. He was born into the world, disrespected and abused. He grew up to disrespect and abuse others. And he died a disrespectful death like a roach that was squashed (and snuffed out) for being annoying. The life of Sangwoo. I think he is far too gone to be redeemed no matter the backstory. it is sad, but it must be done.
They wouldn't have arrested him if they would have found him tied and visibly hurt like he was. I am not blaming him for not telling people the abuse he suffered because it's not easy, but they could have helped him, especially chief Kwak. Plus, he decided to take revenge on innocent people for his sufferings. Bum suffered almost the same if not worse (physical abuse and neglect since he was a little child, rape by the hands of a parental figure, isolation and bullying at school, sexual assault and humiliation at the military) and he never wanted to hurt anyone.
You got a point there. I never thought much about what Bum has suffered before this wild ride with Sangwoo, thanks to your comment now I see him with different eyes. Still, I feel bad for Sangwoo, part of me was waiting for his death because of everything he did, but when it finally happened I just felt sad.
They wouldn't arrest him if they know what ACTUALLY happened but in Sangwoo's mind he was the one who killed both his parents. In Sangwoo's mind, he himself is a murderer. His mother gaslighted him and he was the only witness. If he were to be "honest" to the police, he would have said that he killed his father, his mother helped him to hide the body, then his mother attacked him and he killed her too. Thats how Sangwoo actually sees himself.
He continued killing not because of "revenge". Killing is both
1. a power trip for him; so he feels powerful, unlike when he was powerless and abused by his father,
2. and a way for him to feel safe; to keep the hallucinations of his mother away by projecting his mother into his victims and keeping them in his basement. We saw this when Bum tried to kill himself and the hallucinations came back.
I'm not saying Sangwoo is innocent or that the murders are justified but he is insane and his situation is way more complicated than just killing for revenge. Even by law, he should be charged "not guilty" by reason of insanity and his sentence would probably be mental hospital for life.
Bum was raped and abused too but he wasn't gaslighted into thinking he's a murderer until he met Sangwoo. Bum isn't innocent either, he stalked people and break into their homes to steal their stuff. Its crazy how many people condone this just because Sangwoo did worse.
After that, Sangwoo manipulated Bum and he killed Jieun, violently and without remorse afterwards. He even said he felt nothing. That murder was arranged by Sangwoo but its also a power trip for Bum. He then became afraid of telling people bc he also thinks of himself as a murderer. Thats why he's afraid of Jieun's parents.
A big difference between Sangwoo and Bum is that Sangwoo was convinced by his mother that he can get away with all his murders, just like they got away with his dad, while Bum is conditioned by his anxiety to believe that he will get caught.
KS is a very complex story and part of it just shows how thin the line between an innocent and a murderer is; Sangwoo pushed by his mother to cross the line while Bum is somewhat tiptoeing on the line bc Sangwoo pulled him in.
They wouldn't have arrested a teenager tied with the tape and hurt (he was bleeding!), while the mother was the only one free. And as he found the excuse a double murder happened, he could have found an excuse for the body of his father ( he could have said that he committed suicide, way more believable).
You are exactly proving my point, because Sangwoo did to his victim what his mother did to him (and his father did to her) , all the girls were tied in the basement, maybe raped, tortured, humiliated and killed.
We have no proofs the hallucinations lead him to murder, he didn't kill them on the spot, he lured his preys to his home, he planned their murders ( he planned Jieun's murder for months!). Considering he broke the CEO daughter's legs as well, he even kept them in the basement for days before brutally killing them.
He raped people, he tortured them playing with their lives as they didn't count anything and enjoyed their pain, and even dared to blame the victims because they were "bad people".
You are totally wrong, there is no excuse for insanity because in his case there is premeditation and he is aware of what he is doing. He chose to kill, he created an outward persona in order to cover his crimes, so his sentence was fair.
You didn't understand anything of Jieun's murder. It wasn't a powertrip for Bum, he dissociated, he didn't felt anything because his brain shut down all the emotions as a coping mechanism. He was drooling over himself, he was barely aware of what he was doing, actually asked Sangwoo if Jieun was dead when they were going to bury her.
Sangwoo was disappointed by Bum's reaction, because Bum showed he didn't like to kill. For Bum it was a traumatising experience and he has even been raped by Sangwoo taking advantage of his vulnerability just to guilty trip him.
And he felt remorse, he had nightmares about it and he even told Seungbae he coudln't be saved because he killed a person.
You are ready to find excuses for a person who premeditated most of his killings ( and not alll were related to his mom, so hallucinations aren't an excuse in the case of the gay bar man or the uncle or chief Kwak) while failing to understand that Bum hadn't a choice most of the time. Bum wouldn't have killed anyone if it wasn't for Sangwoo. He clearly showed he was against killing or hurting people when he didn't want his uncle- his lifetime abuser and rapist- dead, and wwhen he refused to stab Seungbae
??? i think u misunderstood me. i'm saying that its not important whether the cops will arrest him or not. What's important is that Sangwoo was gaslighted into thinking he WAS THE MURDERER. He can find millions excuses to not get arrested but in his mind he was not innocent. Same happened to Bum with Jieun where Bum was manipulated by Sangwoo into thinking he Is the murderer.
I'm not finding "excuses" for his murders, I'm trying to figure out the REASON. Its not the same as excuses because it does not make him innocent or rid him of responsibility. The sentence mental hospital for life really means he'll be imprisoned for life in a mental hospital.
Its not that we have no proof that Sangwoo's hallucinations led him to kill, the manhwa was written to imply that Sangwoo did all the murders by copying BOTH HIS PARENTS; keeping the girls tied in basement was the same thing his father did to his mother and what his mother did to him. The motives for Sangwoo's murders vary because he just finds any excuses to kill people and keep them in his basement, but at its roots they weren't "revenge" murders. He only needed to kill in order to feel powerful hence safe from the shadows of his parents, which is ironic because he also unconsciously sees his parents as the powerful "example".
I also never said Bum had a choice in Jieun's murder, when i said he wasn't innocent i was referring to the stalking. I was comparing Jieun's murder to what happened with Sangwoo and his mother, I even said Bum was never gaslighted into being a murderer UNTIL he met Sangwoo, then Sangwoo did it to him. Both hid the murders from the police because they thought they were responsible for it. Even until the end Bum lied of what happened with Jieun because of how brutally she was killed and how he thought he did it because of what happened in his past. Its the same with how Sangwoo too also felt he had no choice but to lie about what happened with his parents.
I don't think u even had any inclinations to emphatise with Sangwoo at all and was too busy being defensive of Bum that u get mad at the slightest comparison. Just remember that they're both only manhwa characters not real life people so it is not against morality to emphatise in order to understand the murderer. At the end of the day it is your choice whether u like this ending for Sangwoo or not but u cant make everyone agree with ur opinion.
I didn't mean you can't empathise for Sangwoo, it's your choice, and i won't judge you for liking a murderer and a rapist because he doesn't exist. But you are ready to defend him as his actions weren't intentional. All the murders after the death of his parents were intentional, so insanity couldn't be used as an excuse because premeditation implies he was aware of what he was doing. He was perfectly functioning in RL, he knew what's wrong and what's right, everytime he brought a person at home, he was aware he was going to torture and kill them and he enjoyed every fucking moment of it ( see the gay bar man's death, it's like a game for him, or how he treated Jieun)
Being gaslighted into being a murderer doesn't make you going murdering people and enjoying it. Bum never wanted to do it again for example. But Sangwoo, especially in season 1 and 2, was a narcissistic sadist without remorse.
the revenge is that with the murders Sangwoo was in a position of power and he could feel powerful he wasn't a victim anymore, so it's still a revenge towards his abuser, especially because he targets girls who looks like her.
I admit that i appreciate how Sangwoo's death was a karmic death, i think nobody deserves to die alone and in pain, but since he didn't care for the pain of his victims, included Bum's pain, why feeling bad for him who played with other people's lives as they meant nothing? He who was a misogynistic, ableist, homophobic rapist and until his last day (at least before the fire) abused and tried to kill the only person who cared for him?
And i don't know if it's your case, i don't mean any offense but i feel most people are sad for him just because he was handsome, because if he looked like the uncle, everyone would have rejoiced to his death.
well said. regardless of his backstory, Sangwoo was an all out horrifying person that cared nothing except his sadistic desire. Its time for fujoshis to stop thinking about their hormones just because there is a gay character in it. If Sangwoo was ugly, I bet no one would be feeling like this
I genuinely love Sangwoo as a character and I feel bad for him. I don't like that people demonise him as if his character is only that of a murderer with no back story.
Sangwoo is most likely a psychopath but as a child, as with most psychopaths he isn't inherently violent. (Heck kid sangwoo is actually kinda cute tbh) He went through a lot; from his mother trying to kill him, watching his mother cheat on and gets beaten up by his father, constantly mentally abused and on top of that his own mother sexually abuse him. Since he was young (making him watch her had sex) until finally she raped him.
I'm not saying he's innocent because clearly he's lost that innocence, but up until he's in highschool (?) he wasn't fcked up. It wasnt until she gaslighted him into thinking he's already a murderer(by "taking part" in killing his parents) that everything went downhill.
Even now he's still suffering the consequences of her actions. I actually don't mind if he dies because at least his sufferings would end... probably. Though it'll be boring.
Every time I start to feel compassion for him I remember he broke both of Bum's calves and made him crawl around the house for months.
After, he of course stalked him and entered his house illegally... j.s.
i need it to have a resolution.. my heart hurts so much oh god TT someone please tell me it has a happy ending