
God, is that girl annoying! I am supposed to root for someone who is nearly an adult yet doesn't know how to treat people like humans? "I didn't have parents" is not a good enough excuse for acting the way she does. Buddy, you had everything else. Until recently, you were the only female offspring that the duke had. You were the tentative heir and all the privileges that came with it. You never had a competition threatening your future until now. So, why are you such a bitch to everyone! I can understand your aggression against the other candidate and the fact that you're on edge but you are old enough to know right from wrong, to know not to treat other people the way you do. You are old enough to control your impulses and to not abuse the people serving you. Why is the story writing trying to potray her as the victim when she is out there degrading, assaulting and abusing the servants for no good reason but also, presenting the other potential heir as the embodiment of evil for acting antagonistic towards the MC when she does clearly have a reason for it?
This is why I hate this breed of self-insert fanfiction that has oversaturated all genres of manga and related art forms. They struggle to remain consistent with themselves even for a single chapter. These works are worse than Mary Sue. This is Mary's mom, Deux ex machina, who earlier used to stay in the background taking care of everything for her dear princess but apparently she wanted her own time to shine. This MC does not make a compelling hero protagonist. She needs to be an antagonist who either gets reformed after an encounter with the protagonist or learns their place once and for all.
There's a very good reason why there exists the time-honored tradition of these flawed characters only being deuteragonists, tritagonists, secondary characters, arc antagonist, main villain and such, but rarely a hero. Even the stories that do feature them as a protagonist uses them to teach a lesson to readers to not be like the protagonist. Because they just don't work. Presenting them as the POV "positive" character in a hero vs villain story just makes the inconsistency in logic blatantly obvious. Such stories should not, then, expect the reader to cheer for such a protagonist while simultaneously booing the supposed villain, when there's hardly a difference between the two. Often the villain is more sympathetic.
But, no, centuries of literary tradition was stupid, according to a certain generation of people, for not writing their protagonists as OP, infallible gods that must be worshipped unquestioningly. Character growth, to them, is so uncool. So, they decided to correct the course of literature and ended up suffocating the whole genre with their chuunibyou fantasies.
Also, the setting is just so hilarious that I can't look past it. Isn't the power transfer thing just like primogeniture? It has never crossed the minds of a single royal family that they needed to kill all their other kids once the tentative heir safely survived to adulthood and produced the next generation of potential heirs. Why the hell do they need to kill the other daughters once one of them manifests the power? Nothing makes sense here. If the duke only needs one daughter to manifest the power and then, must kill the rest, what does he keep the son around for? Since only daughters can inherit the mystical power, and you are supposed to kill the ones who don't, what are they having sons for? Shouldn't they be killing male offsprings at birth, then? Is it that only males in the family can produce female offsprings capable of inheriting the power? If not, why kill non-mystical daughters and not sons? Even evilness should make some logical sense, come on.
Given this ridiculous background, I even understand the duke not caring about the MC. He is not exactly a father to either of those girls, yet. He's just a boss (more like a master) who happens to be genetically related to them. I sympathize as well. Given that these people are expected by some higher power to kill the spares, it just makes sense to treat female offsprings as a tool, until the heir has been decided, and only then, adopt the winner as your child. After all, you shouldn't mix up your pets and your livestock or else you'd end up with neither.

Normal people are warned to stay away from this. Only the first couple of chapters are enough to discern that this is gonna be problematic on so many levels.
The MC is creepy, entitled, unlikeable and has a very twisted on human relationships. At his ripe old age of 31, that guy still believes in the deranged nonsense that you can't love someone and prioritize them and trust them to do the same for you unless they are romantically interested in you.
The ex is a straight guy who used to be the closest friend to MC but he got involved with the MC in the wrong way because the MC was a dishonest friend that deliberately misled him for his own nefarious intentions, the ex himself was suffering under the delusion that your closest social relationship has to be romantic, and all this came together into causing him to confuse his friendly love for the MC as romantic interest.
The ML is 23, barely out of college intern, who is apparently so sex-starved that he mixes up the idolization and admiration that he feels for a highly accomplished senior professional in his field, nearly a decade older than himself, with sexual desire. And unfortunately, for this exceedingly immature person, he gets manipulated by that senior, who would be morally expected to nip such problematic sexual interactions in the bud and help a confused young colleague see wisdom, but instead that perverted creep decides to take advantage of the mistake in judgement made by his much younger newbie, who is very, very junior to him in a professional as well social sense, and decides to turn in into an opportunity to exploit the boy to satisfy his own twisted fetishes.
This pervert just cannot help himself but be obsessed with people who are strictly off-limits. Why can't he go after other androphilic men, closer in age and hierarchy, instead of chasing straight men and cradle robbing? What are you, James Charles?
I just can't comprehend how so many people are liking these Donald Trumps and Harvey Weinsteins, that these kinds of plotlines have multiplied like cockroaches and absolutely overwhelmed the entire shoujo(includes josei, shounen ai, yaoi, and a good chunk of shoujo ai and yuri as well) library completely. These days you have to root around in a mountain of turd, to find a sane story with normal people as characters.

I haven't read too far in yet. Only upto where you find out that the MC's lost his best friend and almost his whole team who were cruelly killed fighting a war that the "God" of their world is forcing them to fight. He is a war veteran suffering from severe PTSD, survivor's guilt and debilitating levels of grief who wishes to die but is being pushed to live because friends that he lost in that dungeon each saddled him with a last wish hoping that sense of duty will keep him alive until he can somehow heal. I hadn't really expected, given the yaoi tags on this story, that I would find this stirring of a story writing, and difficult topics like being handled respectfully instead of being shoved in just for the sake of drama and fear factor. But, now I am worried about reading further. Because I am loving this now but since this is going to turn into romance sooner or later, I am not going to able to finish this and stay just as happy at the end of it. I don't want to be disappointed so I am just going to stop here and leave with good memories instead of risking any further chapters. I just wish they'd kept romance completely out of this or made it so minimal that no one realises it was even there. Why the hell does a story that starts so well have to be a romance? This deserves to be a action-thriller-character development manga similar to shounen genre.

I will give you unsolicited advice as someone who has finished the novel -- don't stop reading here. Youll get what you're asking for, much more than that, I assure you, and the romantic aspect is not just an afterthought but is genuinely part of their character growth. My only gripe here is that this smut chapter should not have been shown here YET although we have already seen them have so much tension between them. It was probably an editor decision to show smut here just to please the readers who are looking for that kind of action

From what I’ve seen in the novel and what’s out so far, the romance feels very organic and ties into the plot very well thematically.
I’ll be honest though, immediately discounting this story because it has romance makes no sense especially since the relationship between characters IS a crucial part of character development.
I don’t mean to be accusatory when I say this too, but nobody would be making this complaint if this was a heterosexual romance. There are plenty of popular AND well written shounen serieses with heterosexual romance and people don’t immediately chalk it up to being bad. I understand BL stories with a plot can have a stigma but if you’ve seen the writing so far and it’s proven to you that it is competent, shouldnt you trust that over inherent biases?

Gurl the Shounen genre exists, just read that then
BL Manhwas is SEVERELY lacking with plots like this so taking it the romance, while the plot being superb as it is, wouldn't really distinguish itself to others with the same genre. And i am thankful they managed to balance the amazing plot AND the development of their romance.

I get why people are feeling conflicted here. It's not as simple as just go read shounen. Obviously, they read shounen. They read shounen and romance for different reasons. Just like people watch documentaries and soap operas for different reasons. If you went to watch a soap opera, and it was a soap opera, then it makes no sense to complain why it wasn't a documentary. But, when you went in expecting a certain thing, but are given something better (better, of course, being subjective), you too, would feel a little scared at the potential of your luck running out and it going back to being a soap opera.
I mean, BL audience is famous for their tendency to pick up a classic shounen written by male mangaka from a heteronormative background, with nearly all main characters not showing any homosexual interest, written with a similarly non-homosexual, largely male, target audience in mind and still complain about it not being a romance, specifically same-sex romance. Your bretheren have had such an illustrious history being so vocal about their complaining, that over the last decade, editorial departments for any genre that isn't exclusively about female characters, have probably put up banners everywhere in the office, reminding them to keep the fujoshis/fudanshis happy. Shouldn't you guys, out of everyone, understand when the vice versa comes to knock on your door? At least, the vice versais being a super courteous, respectful guest who is an equal opportunity hater for all iterations of romance, not just the ones about mlm relationships.

To the OP, I haven't read the novel. Only the manhua. And while these guys are right in that the romantic relationship is well-written, I'm willing to bet that it won't matter to you. Because, at the end of the day, it is still a romance. Not an action drama with romance, but a romance with action-drama. If really can't stand romantic relationships suddenly taking over and driving the story just because, instead of motivations that would make more sense, don't bother. You will not enjoy it.

I read both. What I am saying is that I hope the romance doesn't overshadow the plot to the extent that the plot doesn't move forward for multiple chapters at a time (like 10-20 chapters with barely any relevance of continuation) *this only stands for the beginning-middle and not the end ofc
I have read many stories where it's both romance with a well written story and the authors are capable enough to balance between the two perfectly. Never a dull moment. Just the right amount of both (gotta love wuxia)
However I have also read the opposite and it's very frustrating reading something weekly (and even letting it marinate for months at a time) only to come back and we are still at square one. It drives me insane when the story was literally being sold to us as something that can do both. So that is what I mean when I say I hope it doesn't overshadow the writing
If I wanted to read a bl without a storyline then I would read smt that isn't sold to us with a plotline to begin with I swear

I've read multiple stories like this (esp novels, which this one has, and I plan to read it soon) and it's an ongoing theme for these types of stories authors to sell their work to their viewers as both an action/storyline based and a romance all together. If we were to go into metaphors per say, imagine seeing a show being sold as a cooking drama. You'd go into it expecting both, now imagine you go in and there is pretty much zero cooking? (this was unintentional but damn) Lol
Basically meaning it should have balance. If it's too heavily lop sided those reading would feel that the writing is a bit unfocused (I'm just talking in general, not this story in particular)

Another one in the trashcan. The heck was that "isn't one's life more important than family. You are wasting your life away if you can't get a lover". Of all the insane, brain rot! What sort of a statement is that. And why is it being presented as a moral of the story moment instead of a bro, you're unhinged and need help moment. Like, bro, dude, if your family hadn't wasted their own lives away, staked their futures, compromised their own selfish interests for your sake, if they had not chosen to share their lives with you, you'd have been lucky if you survived long enough to spew this kind of nonsense. No one needs a lover. Sexual relationships are completely optional and trivial but you would be no one and nothing without a family. Family is part of your life, the most important part of it.
This is why no matter what recent manhwas, manhuas and webtoons all together could not match the quality of a random manga from a couple decades ago. Because apparently all the writers have turned into horny teenagers without a brain or a heart who are able to spew whatever nonsense that comes to their mind before passing it through the sanity check that one's training and the editorial department would have provided. Something is seriously weird with the yaoi and shounen ai writers. Why is shoujo not nearly as problematic even though they also focus on sexual relationships, but this genre can't hardly last one story without dozens of problematic instances? Even yuri doesn't f**k up as frequently even though those are also stories coming from a historically stigmatized and fetishized homosexual background.

That’s YOUR opinion. Let me remind you that every person’s family is different, not everyone is blessed with a caring family. And if you think abandoning a child is responsible and part of “staking your future”… gosh the fact that people can’t sympathize with Inwoo is crazy. And you’re also forgetting that romantic relationships aren’t always sexual, they can be just as strong as family bonds, so I just don’t get it. Your moral doesn’t apply everywhere, your experience is obviously different so why are you speaking on topics like family if you aren’t familiar with these issues?

Ignore the idiots in your replies. They don't need a response, they need help. You are so based for saying this. Thank you for saying this.
I was gonna check this story out. Thanks to your comment I now know it will be that kind of a story. I seriously hate that romance genre writers casually keep demeaning families and friendships and putting trivial sexual associations above them. You want tension and competition in your story, do it among romantic relationships. Do not involve people's family and friends, unless it is to show romantic relationships peacefully co-existing in their right place in the hierarchy below one's family and friends. You are right. I have read so many shoujos and even some shounen that depict a romantic relationship during the story, that could teach these yaoi guys a thing or two about how to write a romantic relationship when you also want to include the characters' families and friendships in the plot.
Nothing and no one supersedes family. Romantic relationships are such a small part of your life and you have so many people, so many obligations, so much to live for that is far more important than that. We, as a society, need to get out of centuries of patriarchal indoctrination that the sexual association between a man and a woman should take priority. That mate-control, monogamy bullshit was forced on people to serve andro-centric, patrilineal reproductive interests and the administrative interests of a patriarchal society. That is not a natural reality of human condition. The bond between a primary caretaker, usually the mother, and the child, is the core unit of human society.
The whole reason that we are social creatures at all are for the sake of acquiring and maintaining kinship bonds. We need people to stop taking those kinship bonds for granted. Stop abusing the love and loyalty that your family holds for you.
Any problematic statistic that you bring up about familial arrangements are several times more problematic for romantic arrangements. If you can compromise for years and years to stay with an unrelated peer in a relationship where you are constantly treated like a child, expected to give up many of your freedoms, expected to grant privileged access to your household, your whereabouts, your social life, your professional life and your finances, don't whine when you are expected to do that for your own goddamn flesh and blood. Don't demonize getting treated like a child by your parents and then romanticize getting treated like a child by a stranger.
If you expect your parents, siblings, children, other members of your family and friends to be there for you no matter what, then you need to do the same for them. If you keep treating them as expendable stepping stones, then it is in their best interests to cut you off. People just bet on the fact that for a parent, to cut off a child, is easily one of the cruelest decisions they can be forced to make, so people keep trying to test the boundaries confident that they can ultimately force their parents to compromise. Stop thinking of that as okay or that you're entitled to act like that. You want to enjoy your privileges as a part of your family? You better start fulfilling your duties to them.

I understand and agree with your statement but I think what that person was trying to say is that you shouldn’t need a partner to fix you, even if your bond is equal to a platonic friend’s or family it can easily become unhealthy and lead to total codependency. You shouldn’t be unable to live without your lover and that is what was happening in the story for a bit. My point is that psychologically speaking it’s a bad idea to fully rely on your lover and if you do it’s incredibly easy for the relationship to turn toxic. I disagree with their views on family though

I think that outside the whole obsession they seem to have with family they actually do have a point. Although that point can be made with romance in general it’s most prominent in BL. Saying “bffr” and nothing else is kind of pointless like this person wrote 150 words of argumentation and all you have is mockery that they might’ve made a new account? I don’t fully agree with anyone here but both sides are acting incredibly immature (including the ones you’re disagreeing with I’m not trying to diss you here)

While I appreciate your perspective, it seems they didn't engage with my response at all. I said that everyone's situation is unique, and their definition of family may not apply to everyone. They just expanded on their own ideas about the nature of social creatures and whatnot. And while I UNDERSTAND their viewpoint, it feels more like trolling than a genuine discussion (they literally created an account to say that they’re right?? And then wrote books about how I shouldn’t whine about my family, IGNORING what I said about every family being different) Given that they aren't genuinely debating or arguing for that matter, I don’t rlly see why I should respond with anything more than that. Sorry for being immature

what an odd thing to say. a big part of why mc even considered leaving his family was because of the fact that he was gay, which is a core part of his identity, something that makes him who he is. not being able to be honest about that without being judged, to someone so essential in your life is absolutely exhausting and would mess you up. you wouldn't say the same if it was a friend who was in that position, because obviously who would want to be friends with someone who can't accept who you are? I'm not saying that a friend and family are in the same position, but it's the same principle. in fact, it might be worse, because a family isn't a choice and they're irreplaceable. if they can't even love you for you, how the fuck do you expect to be happy?

I’m not gonna pretend that I didn’t zone out reading most of this long paragraph. But I do want to just give my two cents. I work at a counseling center in the front office. And I see countless children, who were failed/abandoned by their mothers and fathers, their parents are either in jail or no longer in the picture. And now these poor children are left with this trauma, and unresolved loneliness, because their parents were selfish, and only thought about themselves. Can you for a minute imagine being a young child, your mother the person who is supposed to take care of you just abandons you. Like why did she get to escape the abuse, but Inwoo didn’t. The fact you can’t even empathize with Inwoo, who at a young age was abandoned by his mother, and abused by his father is a bit concerning. All I know is, Inwoo is allowed to be selfish with his mother, just like she selfishly left him behind. A family is not just limited to your birth parents/blood. Anyone can be your family, if you choose them to be. I hardly talk to my family, and I do just fine.

This is practically poly in all but name. Perhaps the only tragic poly yaoi out there. These three idiots should've just kicked sexual compatibility and ABO bullshit to the curb, married each other and spent their lovey dovey platonic happily ever after together. I am glad that at least they're all together at the end even if there is no formal declaration. The two alphas are soulmates through and through. The omega and wolf alpha are cleary very into each other. The omega also appears to be attracted to the snake alpha and more importantly, definitely cares for him. The snake alpha similarly cares for the omega as well. Who gives a shit about sexual attraction when you share such a deep friendship where you love and care for each other so much!

At chapter 4, I'm gonna drop it. I will absolutely not stand for stories that will encourage the perception that romantic relationships can compete with and should take greater priority over family and friends. You want drama, do it among romantic relationships. Don't bring in friendships and family unless it is to put entitled sexual relationships in their place. Filial, fraternal, parental and friendship bonds are far too sacred, far too pure and far too important to be put in the category as romantic relationships. This is clearly going to end up with the uke getting his disgusting fetish fulfilled of wanting to displace his boyfriend's lifelong friend as the closest person to him. This is going to end up with the seme treating a sexual partner as more important than a friend. Knowing how shitty yaoi plots can be, they'll probably even end up portraying the deep love and loyalty between the childhood friends as stemming from sexual attraction as well. Because apparently some people are so unhealthy that they have no real relationships, no life left outside of sexual interaction. Unlike normal people, these people are apparently incapable of loving and cherishing people unless they're f**ing them. In their heads, even the most fundamental relationship of humanity, the core unit that makes us human, makes us intelligent, social animals in the first place, the relationships between a parent and their child may be treated as a expendable stepping stone for the sake of something as trivial as a romantic association. I don't understand why more of you don't recognise this for how problematic this is. I, for one, am not going to sit through these kinds of shitty stories.

At chapter 4, I'm gonna drop it. I will absolutely not stand for stories that will encourage the perception that romantic relationships can compete with and should take greater priority over family and friends. You want drama, do it among romantic relationships. Don't bring in friendships and family unless it is to put entitled sexual relationships in their place. Filial, fraternal, parental and friendship bonds are far too sacred, far too pure and far too important to be put in the category as romantic relationships. This is clearly going to end up with the uke getting his disgusting fetish fulfilled of wanting to displace his boyfriend's lifelong friend as the closest person to him. This is going to end up with the seme treating a sexual partner as more important than a friend. Knowing how shitty yaoi plots can be, they'll probably even end up portraying the deep love and loyalty between the childhood friends as stemming from sexual attraction as well. Because apparently some people are so unhealthy that they have no real relationships, no life left outside of sexual interaction. Unlike normal people, these people are apparently incapable of loving and cherishing people unless they're f**ing them. For them, even the most fundamental relationship of humanity, the core unit that makes us human, makes us intelligent, social animals in the first, the relationships between a parent and their child
Another yaoi trash where they're trying to tell you that a boytoy or girltoy is more important than family, that they should be always be treated kindly, given endless benefit of the doubt and accomodated no matter how grossly defective they may be but you should subject everyone else, even your family, to the harshest, most unrelenting scrutiny. They're trying to indoctrinate you with the poison that family is always the problem, never you and definitely never your pet, and being yourself is about abandoning your family and putting a stranger over everything and everyone else just because you have the hots for them. This is another one of those garbage romances that is polluted with the idea that you stick with your hoe (note: hoe is meant to gender neutral here) no matter what but only keep family and friends around if they're perfect at all times. These people act as if anything you do for friends and family is a favour but a lowly sexual relationship has a natural claim to your utmost care and effort. When any healthy, intelligent person would instinctively know that it's supposed to be the other way around.
One of the very few areas that I concede that less advanced societies are better than us in is the understanding of interpersonal relationships. They understood that kinships were the most important and essential human bonds and gave them the position of primacy. With friendships and alliances following right behind. Sexual relationships were looked down upon and treated as a frivolity as they should be. They had it right. This mate control, parasocial stalker level
insanity should be limited to the shamed and shadowed corners of culture but unfortunately, it's overflowed out of the fringes and polluted even the mainstream.
Bro what are you on about
We got the mayor of yapville over here
Translation for the people:
"Hi, I read a gay romance and got personally offended that the characters chose their partner over their toxic family. Now I'm spiraling into a TED Talk about how sex is evil, love is a scam, and ancient societies had it right. Apparently, caring about your partner makes you brainwashed, but blind loyalty to family—no matter how shitty they are—is peak intelligence. Also, I hate fun, affection, and anything that makes me feel things."
Hope that helps. ╮( ̄▽ ̄)╭
I couldn't even finish reading
lol
um.. lay off my man. idk what meds you’re taking but jake is not the one.
Lmaoooo needed that translation ( ˘ ³˘) hope you didn’t lose braincells reading that ish ٩(ᐛ)و
You know, “blood is thicker than water” has been bastardized, but it doesn’t mean what people think it means. It’s actually the opposite.
The full quote is "The blood of the covenant is thicker than the water of the womb." What it means is that bonds forged through shared experiences, loyalty, and chosen relationships are stronger than those formed by blood or family ties and…
I remember reading once that your SO should be the most important person because they are the person YOU chose to love.
Hajime from Fruits Basket Another also said it well when talking about his biological grandpa.
So, no there is nothing wrong in choosing your partner if family is no good.
not even chatgpt could come out with this shit
New copy paste dropped
Are you on drugs or the lack thereof?
whats bro on about
Thank u! I read first 2 sentences of og post and I was all "yup I ain't reading all that mumbo jumbo" ( ´-ω-)
I did I have to reread it about 10 times to comprehend wtf this person was saying.
You're welcome, this person didn't take their meds today and I'm just stepping in as their caretaker!
May I suggest potentially disconnecting the internet? That would help everybody involved ALOT and we would appreciate that. (´▽`)
Bruh I gave up. Your comment is too damn long and I can't go onXD.
That took courage fam (;´༎ٹ༎`) I’m sorry for your loss but applaud the bravery
Period
Ma'am, this is an automobile repair shop...
are you very dumb in the head be honest
lmaooo keep wacking OP. they deserve it! ╮( ̄▽ ̄)╭
.....it seems yur upset about yur spot at the 'kiddies table' for family dinners ://
Definitely a mayor of yapville. Can’t be anything else.
I only read the version that has been summarized by another commenter in the thread lmfao and it says it all