AstroKat's Topics (10)

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Thank you!(๑•ㅂ•)و✧

Sure!! No problem(づ￣ ³￣)づ

Haha, I thought so too at first, but it's Wallace's hand ٩(๑❛ᴗ❛๑)۶

She is the reason we are having a sequel (▰˘◡˘▰). But seriously though, if you havent read this story yet, dont target her as the antagonist because you'll love her very very much. In my opinion, she is the main character instead of Ayeon.

Very very very true. You'll end up rooting for dahye even tho she's kinda twisted with a manipulative personality. But hey! Thats her charm. Considering what happens in the prequel, all the other characters seem a bit bland compared to her tbh.

Probably ostensibly because he over-used birth control and heat suppressant medication for years and years.
But I sort of suspect it's really because the mangaka didn't want to draw it, she wanted an omega that was strong, smart and ambitious and cared a lot about work... but she got complaints from readers busting their ovaries over the lack of baby. The fact that he can't have kids isn't really emphasised or treated as something sad until the sequel (correct me if I'm wrong). Just like people in real life, not every fictional person wants to have kids - but some readers probably wouldn't accept that.

Other omegaverse authors interpret the theme to show that over using or misusing contraceptives and heat suppressants can cause infertility or lead to cancer. I'm guessing he damaged his fertility as a result of misuse of his medicine, as opposed to say it being the result of an STD. Also, some authors also show that the omega characters experience menstruation if they don't fall pregnant during their heat. Also, I guess if society finds out that the omega is infertile, they will face even more stigma due to not being able to fulfill their expected role.

The mental gymnastics in this genre are certainly, erm interesting. (⌒▽⌒)

I doubt it though! I think the mangaka planned on making karasuma infertile since the very beginning. If you look at it carefully Karasuma is seen doing everything that makes you infertile i.e. excessive smoking, drinking, consumption of contraceptive routinely to an alarming extent. Besides, when Tobinaga entered he made a statement like Karasuma's smell had changed. Back then I thought he was probably pregnant already. Now I think it was bc he lost his fertility and that was even before he formed a pair with keisuke!

We'll probably never know so I'm purely speculating, but I think (and thought at the time) that his smell was changing because he was already subconsciously starting to bond with Keisuke, before any bite or anything. I like to think that he was drawn to Keisuke and starting to emotionally reject the idea of being with anyone else, so his pheremones were reflecting that! And I feel like that's why it was irking his ex.

I agree that the mangaka never planned for Karasuma to get pregnant, but I suspect that having him just not be the type to want kids would make readers less sympathetic, so she needed an excuse for him not to. Smoking and drinking *can* damage fertility to an extent, but I just don't feel that him smoking and drinking were part of any infertility plan. Heaps of people smoke and drink to excess and still get knocked up, (unfortunately for the baby)!

I admit, though, as someone who doesn't want kids and sometimes gets uncomprehending or judgemental reactions about it, maybe I just see him this way because I relate to that.

glad you see it that way too lol, you bitch quite a lot in the comments about how stupid mpreg is and readers wanting it and interpret quite a lot in a rather normal story trope

i personally see his infertility a lot more like a story device used for some more drama and 'depth' (for both the story and the relationship) and nothing more. for one, it's a little bit like robin in how i met your mother, she never wanted to have children, but when she found out that she also cannot have children, she was devastated. because not wanting something and hearing you can never have something is different. karasuma lived a life where he never would have imagined bonding, loving, having a normal healthy relationship, so children also probably never really crossed his mind.
now not being able to have them even if he wanted them, which is a wording that he used himself ('even if i thought of creating a family' which implies he didn't do really do yet or planned), while being in a loving relationship (which also involves a second person, who may wants children and would leave bc of this) is obviously not some small thing he can just overlook. it's literally life changing. i don't think he and keisuke even really discussed any family plans, and i even would go so far as to say karasuma avoids that topic, i also assume he thinks he's not worthy of having children because of his past. so we do not know if he even would want children anyway, but infertility is still damn hard to swallow, because you can never change your mind about it. it's not yours to decide anymore no matter what. it's not a choice or decision anymore.


and that is literally doing what omegaverse is there for, using problems males and male couples usually do not face because they are problems related to women and make them a thing for them.

and the mangaka couldn't have done it if karasuma was like 'lol kids? no never!' (which also is bad for keisuke if he wanted to have them), so them figuring out what they want, would want and do AS A COUPLE is just the best way to do it, for them as a couple and for us readers. (especially because readers would need a reason to read the sequel..especially bc the second couple is rather lame) saying she wouldn't have made karasuma not wanting children because readers wouldn't understand is a little bit idiotic, i mean it would be a little dumb to choose a new genre of men being able to get pregnant to make a story about a guy who completely ignores this ability, unless that's the plot haha, but really, given karasuma's personality and shown actions, after all the sluttiness etc. i doubt anyone would be like 'what, someone like that doesn't want children? wow bad story lollolol', it would only be problematic if we feel like keisuke would want them but chooses karasuma over that.

...really, stop acting like you're a victim of society for not wanting children. apart from your parents and your partner, no one even cares if you reproduce or not. they may don't understand that choice, but you also clearly don't understand those who do and judge them, so i think you can't complain about that

'But I sort of suspect it's really because the mangaka didn't want to draw it, she wanted an omega that was strong, smart and ambitious and cared a lot about work..' so any woman who is strong, smart and ambitious and who cares about her work cannot be shown pregnant or having children, because those 2 things just can't go together?? really guys, we live in 2018, not 1950. who even says karasuma would turn into the stay at home parent here lol

Well I like the idea of Karasuma seeing Keisuke as a potential parter too. Especially since a chap before Tobinaga enters Karasuma asks Keisuke if he'll for a bond with Karasuma out of pity atleast and Keisuke never denied it. So it is also a possibility. But turning infertile too changes a person's body in ways that may not be visual but exit. Pheromones are meant to attract a partner for procreation in omegaverse. If he is infertile and his body knows it than he doesn't need them and so his body may have gone through a change. Nobody knows exactly!

Besides I doubt he was supposed to be a person who doesn't want children more like he never thought of having them. You see nobody around him actually saw him as a person till Keisuke came along. Everyone used him and he used everybody in return. So I doubt he had any flowery dreams of having a mate and kids till Keisuke came along! Not even normal people think of kids until a suitable person comes along.

Also, when I say he was shown to do stuff that makes one infertile in excess, I meant it to be a culminative of his lifestyle since he was a teenager. That is for about 20yrs now Karasuma has been relying heavily on contraceptives foremost and later on ciggs and alcohol. That is some serious damage to one's body in real too. Most doctors will advice avoidance of regualar contraceptives if not sexually too active, use only when needed is what they'll say. That is to avoid depletion of one's chances to have kids. Besides fertility is a changeable issue unless it is due to anatomical resons. We may as well find now that his life is stable he may be able to bear a kid after some time lapse. This happens in real life too.

I think that Karasuma is a strong, smart, ambitious person who cares about work and has to deal with the struggles of being an omega. He has to navigate an extremely unequal and unfair social system, and he uses his omega status as a weapon. That's what makes him interesting and that's what Keisuke originally respects him for. He doesn't need "women's issues" to make him interesting.

Personally I appreciate omegaverse stories that still treat their main uke/omega character as a man. I would love to read a story about an omega seme, or a/b/o seke couple in any configuration. Like I said in my comment below, the omegaverse social structure is an interesting setting, and mangaka can tell a compelling story set in it, without making it all about "But what if ukes really WERE like women??" And really, a comment about a manga that doesn't feature a pregnant omega is "bitching a lot" to you? Male pregnancy is ridiculous, sorry if you can't handle that. Like I also said, I leave it alone when there IS mpreg, but I wish there wasn't so much raining on my babyless-omegaverse parade when it's absent.

"so any woman who is strong, smart and ambitious and who cares about her work cannot be shown pregnant or having children, because those 2 things just can't go together??" ...He's not a woman. You know that this story (and, um, BL) is nominally about guys, right? The push of female readers identifying with ukes is why some yaoi is bordering on homophobic, it's so heteronormative.

Yeah, you could be right for all we know! I just think that the whole story focuses way more on the social side of omegaverse, rather than the biological/reproductive side. Refreshingly (in my opinion) there were no alphas going into a frenzy, and no omegas going into heat and begging to be impregnated. Instead there was a nasty system of sexual exploitation in a business/economic sense, which is social rather than biological. Even Keisuke's dad was sleeping with alphas to be financially able to raise his kids. Alphas wanted to sleep with omegas, but in this story, none of them wanted to get the omegas pregnant. That wasn't the point of sleeping with omegas, in what we were shown. That's why I feel that Karasuma's child-bearing capability is incidental - I don't see it as being important to the story sensei was trying to tell, and the world that is being shown in the story. But I do feel like it might have come up a lot in readers' reactions.

have you understood omegaverse tho? or 'women issues'? a man able to produce children and thus looked down upon by society, regarded as only a womb or a sex toy who in some stories isn't allowed to work, own property, etc. and generally looked down on by strong, independent men in high positions called alphas, who even go as far as raping omegas because who cares what they think. menstruation and the fear of being impregnated against your will, bearing children into the world or sex as your whole purpose of being etc. it's literally taking the struggles women have gone and still go through in society in tons of cultures for hundreds of years lol. the fact that it is happening to a man or rather separated from gender (because omegas can be both female and male, as can alphas) is exactly that makes the structure interesting lol. it's not treating the omega as 'not a man' when you give them another stand in society and have them to deal with problems that are usually related to gender. it's exactly that they STILL are men that is the fundament of omegaverse. omegas are in the same position real women are and were. deal with it.

i also don't get people wanting to read about omegas topping or sekes and beta relationships in omegaverse for that reason, because it completely defies the purpose. it's basically the usual gay problems all over again, not being able to have children because of loving a beta, an alpha or omega not being supposed to be with a certain other second GENDER, and normal gay sex or having sex that's not 'intended' biological. i mean, how is that different from any normal slash??

so really, there is just no need to make a story omegaverse if your plot would work the exact same w/o, so it may is a compelling story, but not omegaverse.


it's more than one comment, and it's not the comment itself my dear, apart from the fact that yes, bitching about mpreg in a story that doesn't feature mpreg (but potentially could) is still stupid, sorry to break it to you. it's like going under a yaoi NOT featuring rape and and writing an essay about how rape sucks. because it didn't happen, so why bitch there? it's also still omegaverse, if you don't like mpreg nor omegas dealing with problems related to having the role of a woman in society, why even read the genre? like i said, what you like about omegaverse can be found in normal yaoi too.

it's less commenting about being glad there is no mpreg, but just your overall judgement. like you just did again. it's ridiculous? i assume you aren't gay then, congrats. because not being able to have biological children with your lover that share both your DNA and theirs is not 'ridiculous'. it's something people have to accept because they cannot change it yet, but it's not a 'small problem no one cares about'. knowing that you will never have a child with your love one that really is made out of both of you can be really hard. especially because in many countries, like japan, gay couples aren't allowed to adopt. that means they cannot have children - at all -. i know you don't want them, but others do and it's important to them.being able to conceive would automatically allow them to have children because you cannot forbid people from having children in natural ways, luckily for gay women. and come on, men can breastfeed now thanks to medical improvement, while they probably never could give birth without unnecessary problems, it's not far fetched that we will reach the day were the DNA of a sperm can be transferred to a pre-emptied ovum and be fertilized by the other.

the reason people dislike your view on having children probably has nothing to do with you not wanting them personally, but your idiotic views on those people who do want or have them. get over yourself, having children is completely natural, and people seeing this as a life and relationship goal is too. just because you do not see it as a thing you want doesn't mean the majority of human kind has to act like it's totally unnecessary too. learn to empathize lol and don't take yourself as the parameter people have to live by. it's not 'dumb' of readers to want to see them with children, it IS omegaverse after all. again, the whole concept is some men are able to conceive.


and hah gurl, omegas do not exist in real life, so only women can get pregnant, like even you yourself observed correctly. you clearly think that having children or being pregnant and being (seen as) a strong and successful person can't go together, so you obviously think this about women because omegas are fictional. if i would say omegas are weak and dirty for having menstruation and bearing children that would obviously be sexist and not to the fictional omegas.

well, it's made by heterosexual women for other heterosexual women. but the people saying yaoi is so heteronormative are doing the exact same thing, because they think a bottom is in a bad unmanly position and thus should also top, because they think a bottom liking housework is automatically feminine because it's a female trait (lol) and thus bad, saying a man cannot act feminine if he's gay because that's heteronormative IS heteronormative. if you think a guy has the 'female part' because he gets fucked you're the one putting heteronormative standards on there. there is no female role, no woman, but that also means a guy doesn't need to fuck the other one to be more manly or equal. and it's also heteronormative to think that all heterosexual relationships follow some hetero manual 101. but that's not the discussion we were having anyway lol, i was calling out your sexism. it's even more ironic when of course women identify with the omega because they face the same struggles in society. you just said yourself that you would prefer or want karasuma to not wanting children because you yourself do not want them. so..stop identifying with the uke please?

Hmm... You have an impressively realistic POV, so much so that generally optimistic outgoing people will find it sorta pessimistic... I liked it though. A different take on omega's struggles as a man.. But you know omega in itself is a different kind of sex neither male nor female.. If I have to phrase it in general terms then as they like to say omega is a child bearing male.. So you can't term his ability to bear child as a negligible factor. The female audience tend to sympathize with an omega bc irl women are(even now to some extent) treated that way in society.. A person whose main role is to bear child. That is the biological side is an eminent part of social side.

About Karasuma's sexual relations, they all resulted from his logic that if everyone's gonna view his as a convenient hole to satisfy their desires then he can use those as a convenient ladder to upgrade his position. It went both ways you know.

Karasuma is a strong ambitious person but he relied way too much on his sexuality. He started it all as a rebellious teenager and found it convenient enough to follow it all the way through his productive years(both biologically and from career prospects). I am not saying what he did was totally wrong but instead of working really hard he chose a rather convenient yet difficult way of doing things which is probably why Keisuke sorta respected him. But there is still a possibilty that if Karasuma had worked his way up his life could have been better which is why Karasuma sorta regrets doing things the way he did. Also since he is an omega paired with an alpha it is his role to bear child as per social norms which he has been unable to and that is what makes him sad. His being unable to give his partner that kinda happiness could be the result of his lifestyle upto now is what makes him regret it all even more. Look at Karasuma as an individual born as an omega rather than a man or woman, you might get it then. For Karasuma both his career and his role in their pair are important.

And this is where it gets tricky. I AM actually a member of the LGBTQ+ community. (I'm guessing you're not.) But I'm also a woman, and a feminist. So, here's where you're a dick.

All the issues you brought up that face women are totally valid. I don't have to be a "breeder" to know that (I use the term facetiously), women's struggles are real and important. BUT. Take them to platforms and manga genres that are about FEMALE characters. That is a legitimate opinion, from someone who has many gay male friends and cares about gay representation. Just listen to yourself. Without the usual omegaverse treatment it would be "the usual gay problems all over again"??? You ARE homophobic. You're no ally. Gay male couple's problems are also real and important, and straight women writing gay-bois-as-women for straight women are open to criticism.

In some omegaverse stories anyone can impregnate/bear children regardless of sex, which opens up the possibilities - same-sex couples of any type, alpha-alpha, beta-beta, etc. That sometimes means it might be a story I will enjoy, but... it still doesn't make sense conceptually. It will never make sense. It's stupid. Learn science in high school, or any subject with "evolutionary" in the name at uni. Please. Evolution doesn't work uphill. Omegaverse will never not be stupid, scientifically, if you add in male pregnancy. Yes, it's fiction. But it's stupid fiction.

By the way, I really shouldn't have to say it, but who implied that position during sex has anything to do with personality or character traits??? Assuming that it does is sexist, homophobic and heteronormative - which I think, from somewhere in your rant, you agree with. Hooray! We concur. Common ground.

Why are you so threatened and hostile about the opinion of one person who doesn't want kids? I like the story because it resonates with me as someone who doesn't want babies and doesn't think they make a great plot point or happy ending. There are more than enough manga (omegaverse or otherwise) for people who like relationships resulting in babies. Why are you so combative just because I've said that this one is a nice change for me? Gay, straight, bi, male, female, cis, trans, whatever - some people want kids, some people don't. Women who don't want kids are judged or attacked for not wanting them, in a way that men rarely are - that IS a feminist/women's issue. Back the fuck off.

Indeed, usually in this trope the omega character gets reduced to either being regarded as an exploited sexual object, or as a"mother". I understand that omegaverse is meant to be some bastardised view of women and reflecting this onto same sex couples that are men, but the trope is a bit problematic at times. Why can't there be an omega who holds down a job, but also has kids for example. I get why the theme is what it is is, and yes women have and do still face such struggles that are reflected in this omega logic, but isn't it time to move on and have more reflective and positive depictions of same sex couples having children, getting married etc. It just comes off as a bit dated, maybe even homophobic to still see representation of a gay family as being through the eyes of omegaverse or the "a girl who I friends with at uni doesn't want her kid so I adopted it" trope etc. It is what it is, and at the end of the day, we still read such mangas and therefore are supporting such tropes continuing to an extent, but still that doesn't mean we can't look at things more objectively and roll our eyes over certain tropes.

where does it say that he cant have kids?

yeah i'm a dick, doesn't change that you're too. and if you are, and especially not of the '+' then i don't see why you fail to understand that not having biological children or any children for that matter can be hard for LGBTQ people. unless of course you are not keen on empathy at all.


you're kinda contradicting yourself her, will come back to that.

what exactly was homophobic about that lol? i didn't say the struggles weren't real or unimportant, i just said that there is no need for omegaverse for them. if you don't like omegaverse as a genre, fine. but instead you decide to still read it but then want 'real gay men' problems featured. there is no need for omegaverse for that, nor is it like omegaverse is the only type of yaoi out there. there are tons who feature 'normal' problems. yaoi is not even meant for serious representation.
if you don't like that omegaverse makes female struggles genderless, don't read it. and if you want to criticize it then do it for more than it not fitting your personal taste because you want some other kind of representation.

you know how 'stupid fiction' sounds, right? like you didn't get the meaning of the word.
i don't even see how the mpreg is what doesn't make sense, and not the strong pheromones, the heats and ruts, knots etc. lol.

you did. "The push of female readers identifying with ukes is why some yaoi is bordering on homophobic, it's so heteronormative." implying that female readers (only) identify with the uke for him being an uke being heteronormative. to think that a female identifying with an uke is heteronormative kinda makes it heteronormative itself. but again, contradiction.

which i will come to now: "I like the story because it resonates with me as someone who doesn't want babies.(..)Women who don't want kids are judged or attacked for not wanting them, in a way that men rarely are - that IS a feminist/women's issue. Back the fuck off."

sooo, you take a usually pretty female and hetero problem of not wanting children (because like i said, adoption isn't even allowed in many countries, when homosexuality in itself is even legal, nor can 2 men naturally conceive) and you enjoy it and want to read it in an gay (omegaverse) story. even going so far as to call it a women's issue yourself. but at the same time you call people out for omegaverse having women's issues, for females identifying with the uke and it being heteronormative and HOMOPHOBE, for it not tackling real gay problem and in a scientifically possible way (which obviously would be a man not wanting to adopt, and not a man not wanting to conceive himself even though he can and society expects it, which is pretty much a whole different story.) even pointing out that men are rarely treated that way.i think you realized it yourself here, didn't you?

and i am not hostile, i would say you are, i just think that hating something because it doesn't fit YOUR personal taste and badmouthing those who have a different taste for liking it because YOU do NOT is just idiotic.

I wouldn't mind it either tbh, and I feel like he might just become another one of Sangwoo's demons just like his mother was

i don't think sensei will end it so fast like this
also it's possible to survive after cutting your wrist if you're handled quickly

and I don't think Sangwoo is the type to feel compassion toward Boom

Yes I don't think Sangwoo would care for Bum at all, he doesn't, he doesn't have the necessary tools in his brain to care for another human being. How I see it it's very likely that Sangwoo would have ASPD.

Just because Bum dies doesn't mean the series would die. I don't think that is what's going to happen, but it's still a possibility that Koogi-sensei chooses that route. It's a very unlikely possibility, but it's still a possibility.

We also have to take into consideration that the only person that could do anything about Bum's wrists is Sangwoo, the same one that stood frozen as Bum fell to the floor. It's impossible for Sangwoo to take Bum to the hospital. He wouldn't go so far just for Bum.




((I lost the thread but I hope my message can be understood))