Cyannd's Topics (82)

Not really. You need to be aware that people react differently to trauma. There is not only one way trauma can affect someone, it can greatly differ for each person.

While some people cannot experience sexual actions at all after being assaulted without having a mental breakdown or even having to throw up etc. or having flat out ED, others can have a sexual reaction when recalling the things that happened (wanted or not). Much like the protagonist showed: he was forced to feel sexual pleasure and was touched in different ways that stimulated his body further, so now he is in a circle in which he feels sexual pleasure when remembering the assault and, vice versa, he remembers the assault when he feels sexual pleasure.

That is just a realistic portrayal of how a trauma can play out and affect you. Albeit one that is not well known and often ignored.


It is not romanticized. And it is not sexualized either, because he DID feel sexual pleasure when it happened and it is now part of his mental and physical memory.

sadly many japanese women hold the misogynistic views of patrialchal Japan. and this type of behaviour towards women is accepted. and those who protest are looked down. btw all yaoi authors are women, and most editors too, but they work for publishing companies were the higher ups are men.

If you don't understand or are not interested in it, then why not read a different tag? Yaoi means BxB most with sex. Shounen Ai is BxB with no sex, but it is implied

thats not what they said, read the comment again

Lol you COMPLETELY missed the point. Read the comment again.

Sorry guess I misunderstood.

I think drawing BL doesn't mean you are especially tolerant, we can see that clearly through a lot of stories that show terrible prejudices against the LGBTQ even if it involves at some point a man x man sex scene... From what I could understand as I read mangas, some authors don't really have much choice in the genre they draw sometimes, and are requested a BL story whether they understand the LGBT topics or not.

Well said! Your assumptions about mangaka not choosing their genre are somewhat correct. What determines whether they remain in that genre is how well they write and sell. I have a friend who is a shounen/seinen mangaka and he was asked to do a homoerotic scene between two male characters. It was so awkward and awful they never asked him to do it again. He confided in me that he did it that way on purpose. He was uncomfortable suddenly having to thrust his characters into situations he had never planned for. Having scenes like that can drastically alter the outcome, or the expected outcome, of a story. He said he felt like his editor was betraying the story they had planned out and agreed on.

What you said about prejudices is also very true. And it is not just found in the sex scenes. You can find veiled homophobia in many manga. Though I say "homophobia", I don't think it is so much a fear or hate of homosexuality that drives these prejudices, but rather a lack of understanding or education available in Japan regarding homosexuality and LGBT issues. Most schools still avoid the topic of homosexuality in sex ed if they don't outright condemn it and the government actively prohibits foreign LGBT groups from educating the public while using their declining birth and marrige rates as an excuse. Without understanding, acceptance can't grow. When readers cite adult adoption and domestic partnerships as proof of acceptance in Japan, I laugh. Those are not benefits designed for homosexual couples, they are loopholes some homosexual couples have exploited to gain some small benefits. It is hell to be gay in Japan. Though, in comparison, it is not as bad as other places where homosexuality is a capital crime. Homosexuality is seen as little more than a fetish in Japan, no different than cosplay or BDSM, rather than an unchanging and intrinsic part of a person's self. A person who is into a fetish will lose interest as their libido wanes with age. A person who is homosexual will be just as homosexual on their deathbed as they were in their youth. The Japanese accept that homosexuality exists, but they refuse to accept the importance of homosexuality as a facet of a person's being.

Sorry for the long winded rant there. Japan's view of homosexuality confounds and stumps me. They are a social and economic superpower, on par with the US and Europe, yet they are 30 to 50 years behind them when it comes to this topic. Though I understand some of why this is so, it still seems so petty and superstitious to me. I say superstitious because they still believe that one can choose to be homosexual or "turn gay" just by being exposed to the idea.

Right! While I lived in Japan I thought the situation was pretty much "don't ask don't tell". There is not much hatred, well first because Japanese people tend to refrain putting their nose in other people business, but also because they don't even think homosexuality exists in Japan. I did a parade in Osaka and people were just really curious and confused like they had never heard of LGBT before. The number of participating to those things is also ridiculously low compared to other western nations (western in terms of power), many are still closeted and don't come out to this kind of events. Anyway, all that to say it is not surprising stupid prejudices slip in yaoi because it simply reflects the society they live in, although there are still some mangakas who are sensible to this and portray it fine :)

Very well written

Well, it really isn't safe for them to come out to those types of events, even if they are dying to. There is no anti-discrimination law for sexual orientation in Japan. Although most people won't actively invade the privacy of another, if you are outed you can't guarantee that you won't be fired, expelled or evicted. If you were, you have no legal recourse. For that matter, can you imagine trying to live together with your same sex partner in the same house for 10 or 20 years? Tongues would definitely wag! I imagine those who do live together with their partner are either in a position where they feel confident they won't lose their job or live in fear of being outed. As a member of the LGBT community for over 40 years, it breaks my heart. I remember what it was like here in the US when the first gay pride parades took place. I was even present at a few. We have it so good here in comparison to many other countries. I have a friend in Kuwait who is a lesbian. Now, Kuwait is not nearly as conservative as some of its neighboring countries, but she still has to be cautious of even her conversations for fear that her parents or siblings might turn her into authorities for her sexuality. We are truly blessed in the West (gosh what a shitty rhyme, sorry lol). As readers of yaoi and/or yuri it is really important to remember that, although what we read is pure fantasy, homosexuality, and its lack of acceptance, is real life for many people who are not as blessed as we are. They live in the closet and they live in fear and they can never truly be themselves. "Happily ever after" isn't something these people can even dream of, let alone, attain.

Thankfully, the internet offers some much needed information regarding sexuality, though, even that can be quite the mire to slog through with plenty of its own misinformation. But, at least, it is there. Which is something Japan didn't have before. Sadly, the average hetero isn't likely to have "homosexuality" in their search history. The information is there, but they never think to access it. I have also been told by friends in Japan that access to the entire internet isn't readily available. They can't access some sites that I, in the US, have no difficulty in accessing. I am assuming that their government regulates access to sites deemed "inappropriate" or "counter to public welfare". You said you lived there, did you notice this or is it a recent development?

If they say they are boys they are boys. If they say they are girls they are girls. It's really too bad readers get on authors' cases about the portrayal of trans people in fiction (which I acknowledge is horrible in most cases) but then don't realize they themselves are contributing to this attitude.

I am pretty sure that trans represantion in fiction has nothing to do with this

i dont really overthink it that much considering all genres of manga tend to throw in characters with obscure genders. the story is what is important, artstyle is also something that can add or detract from a story. the characters' personalities are pretty important too. their genders are just something to add to the story, so regardless of whether they are designed to be pretty and idealized or are drawn more realistically is all just the authors preference so if you dont like feminine male characters then dont read a manga with a feminine male character

btw this IS an omegaverse story where the difference between men and women literally doesnt exist - the dudes can get pregnant! having feminine guys comes with the territory

Can you tell me which mangakas portray it fine, in your opinion? I started to read again and the only one who cames to mind who does it a bit is Ogeretsu, I discovered her work recently, and I love most of her stories (I need so many updates dammit/Yarichin >_<)

I dont know about that. Just because guys can get pregnant doesnt mean they have to be feminine. In this world not only the word "female" reminds people of pregnancy or whatever but also the word "male". So looking feminine or whatever doesnt really HAVE to be. Also the characters of the omega men are inherantly created as if they were picked up from a hentai manga with their genders slightly tweaked.


This is mostly a rant. People like the original commenter and I are just really done with these type of characters. Sometimes really interesting story settings or plots are ruined because of such characters

if you dislike pretty characters than you might want to try reading bara instead because that genre is designed with more masculine characters.

most BL is shoujo-based so it appeals to people (mostly younger females) that prefer young and pretty characters. bara and if you can find them, seinen, genres focus on more masculine appearances.

Do you think Loplop, for example, has muscular men? at least Harry? I'm trying to find examples.

yes that's a good example, also the other works by that author.

also here's some lists that might interest you:

http://www.mangago.zone/home/mangalist/290536/

http://www.mangago.zone/home/mangalist/111522/

http://www.mangago.zone/home/mangalist/99341/

https://www.mangaupdates.com/series.html?category=Manly+Gay+Couple

Idk I like fem characters... not necessarily the uke tho. I also think that it's probably part of Japan's culture to think of 'wife', 'queen', 'husband', etc. As more to do with general roles in a relationship? Idk don't take my word for it, it's just that it appears so often in manga, even there isn't a lot of feminization going on.

This thread of comments, while I understand their intentions are in the right place, are forgetting that feminine gay men exist IRL and aren’t treated well within the LGBT community. “Masc4masc” culture exists and if feminine gay men are being treated like shit by other gays, it’s a bit of a shame to see non-gays also go “A gay man should never be feminised! He’s a MAN, he should be manly!”

Like, it’s a gay relationship. It’s already outside of the heterosexual structure. If a feminine gay man wishes to behave in that way - fiction or IRL - there’s no difference. My gay friends love to call themselves “auntie” unironically. My single heterosexual dad loves to be called “mom”.

Though - personality and design are different. If a mangaka can design a seme to look like that, but consciously make the decision to draw the uke like a shoujo heroine, it begs the question of a woman’s fetishisation of gay men/self-inserts versus storytelling from a non-fetishist’s POV. Like, there some BL where you can tell it’s the product of a horny woman who wants to be in a gay relationship. But others are well-written and the characters are well-designed - you can see that BL isn’t gay fetish for them, but a way to tell a really fantastic story that they care about.

i agree that each individual character's design and art style is up for preferentiality, this thread is just what came from Cyannd's opinion and we commented. if he/she prefers the manly gays then this manga prob isn't for them but there are many others that they might enjoy. that is why different genres exist and to each their own!

So glad I'm not the only one who thought this! It was really a sweet story, I can't deny that, but the yaoi angle could have just as easily been hetero or friends. Oh, and what the hell was the deal with the stalker dude? We never find out who he was working for or why he was making threats. It really felt like a cute story had all these strange elements shoe-horned into it. Not that yaoi is strange for a fujoshi like me, but it felt strange in this story. The protagonist couple had the chemistry of two stag beetles which made their getting together feel forced. All in all, I will probably forget about this story completely ten minutes after I write this reply. That is sad to me, because there was a lot of potential to it. It just never reached that potential.

Both chapters 29 and 40.

damn

Trueee

I’m weak

HEJDBHENE SKEURVEJWHW LMAO

I love it