I once was called meat rider here for defending and active and so, I'm pride of that tittle. Honestly, it was such a hassle to get me finish this manhwa, 50-74 were pure PAIN, the only thing having me finishing this was Hajoon, it was such a complex and cute character who was wasted in someone as cookiecutter as a bottom is like Sodam. First. He was never taught how to love, nobody loved him the "right" way, the only thing he knew about love was that it hurt and that it could ruin your life, so he was attached at that idea, that was the reason he was so conflicted about his feelings for Sodam, especially after knowing that Sodam didn't remember any of his time together, I mean, he remember but like they weren't precious memories like with him, so he hated Sodam, who wouldn't? And more since he has this twisted idea of love, I loved how the author put his mental state in front of the story and how flickering his feelings could be, cause he doesn't know how to properly manage them, he doesn't even acknowledge them. For him love is the same as hate, but at the same time love is caring, so he hide himself in a facade all his live and since the facade work on the one he loved, he was hurt, not knowing that the mask was in reality broken with them, he obviously made mistakes and hurt Sodam, but how not to? He didn't know how to love or hate correctly, the lines were blurry and his inherent personality was to posses, he never got someone by his side, someone who could understand what he was going through and so nobody who can teach him how to do thing right. Sodam was just a fuckn obstacle all the way around, he only cared about Hajoon when Hajoon cared about him, he never tried to understand him or to learn more about him, he said Hajoon was the first person to have a crush on but never tried anything to accomplish that crush, he even dated other ppl (whe never know anything about these ones), meaning that he already loved people who only loved him, that's why the things he says when Hajoon breaks with him doesn't makes any sense, if Hajoon wasn't as proactive as he was, Sadom will never make any step to be more close to him, as long as other person came and said "I love you" Sadom would probably go into that, that's proven when Liam appears (hate him, the 2nd more hateful character after Sodam), if Hajoon didn't make all the effort of being with Sodam and showing his love in the way he can, Sodam probably would said yes to Liam, Liam was thrash, he was forceful, selfish, egocentric and narcissistic, he never considered the feelings of Sodam, he only wanted him because some bullshit, all the things Hajoon said he did, he really did, that's why I was so upset when sodam was like ⁄(⁄ ⁄·⁄ω⁄·⁄ ⁄)⁄ when Liam stopped his rape attempt like for God sake, he was going to, he had the intention and that is important, he never asked anything about Sodam, he only saw him as a fussy memory of his past, even in the end when he confronted Sodam on why he was still with Hajoon, he was violent and pushy, Kind? Honest? Considered? WHERE?? ARE THOSE HERE IN THE ROOM WITH US? The "advice" Liam gave to Sodam was in reality him talking about how thrash he is and Sodam comparing him to Hajoon and understanding why Hajoon acted some way, he never really talked about some real advice or some sht like that, i was never invested in Liam, he was purely a gwangong kind of characters, and the worst of them tbh and Sodam omg, Sodam, what a gross character, a IA generated bottom, it was like a checklist:
Kind
Cute
Hardworking
Easily manipulated
Brown/yellowish palette
Doesn't communicate
Does whatever other ppls said he should do
No hobbies or interests
Family that hates him/poor
Screams a lot
Fragile and petite
And honestly i can find a ton of other manhwas that checks the stereotypes and still are better than Sodam, he never really tried to help or get closer to Hajoon, he just was cute and by his side, he never asked until Hajoon or Liam told him something about them, they were in college but no even once i saw him doing something with that, he wanted to be friends with Liam just because he liked him even tho Hajoon obviously is not comfortable with him and Liam is still in love with Sadom, if your partner keep seeing someone who is obviously into them, you don't like them and they know but they still see them and even more, make you see them as friends and keeping them around even if they did something awful to you and your partner, would you like that??? I would NOT, not even for a second, if my partner puts his comfort and the comfort of other over mine, does he really love me??? Ah-ha, bullshit. And I will keep doing these comparisons cause people tend to forget any red flag the bottom has but when the top has the slightest flaw, he is thrash and garbage like ??? He is a PERSON too. So yeah, there were parts of Sodam that I liked but his love for Hajoon was really pale in comparison to Hajoon's love for him, I felt that Sodam was playing with Hajoon feelings more that vice-versa, for example, Hajoon would never do something that make Sodam uncomfortable, he would prioritize Sodam above all and never make him jealous, aside from him breaking up with him and not being honest with his feelings (we already talked about how complex his feelings were and how he didn't know how to manage them) but Sodam would lie to him about who he was seeing at night, going to a random house without telling Hajoon, getting flustered by other and still having contact with them even tho they don't get along with Hajoon, Sodam wasn't even sincere about his feelings for Hajoon too, he never confessed, he just said that if Hajoon keeps being kind he would fall in love but he never put the cards in the table, he only forced Hajoon to go on and break himself down to confess, even when he realized that Hajoon broke with him because he was afraid of hurting him, he just guilty-tripped Hajoon, he never tried to contact him or going back to him, something usual in these stories, everyone expects the top to be the one to reach for the other, to give himself entirely for the other but if the bottoms doesn't do that is fine, like ??? So, yeah, Hajoon better character in this, I can't say I liked this one, there were a lot of plot holes and things left aside, Hajoon was played all the way till the end and Liam deserved worse (he used people, he was violent, he never tried to be better or to inherent the business, he never tried to change or do something aside being a playboy), and Sodam was just there... nothing exciting in his head more than "He love me? Yes, obviously, but really? Or not? Umm, I guess not, lol, but now that I think about it, I do love him, but if he doesn't love then I can't love him anymore:( wuwuwuwu"
Liam did a lot of awful things to Hajoon too, he kept calling him psychopath, he stole an important memory from him, tried to rape his partner, bad mouth him in every opportunity he could, tried to steal all the hardwork Hajoon put as the facade of Hajoon in their family even tho Liam throw away his opportunity by being a spoiled brat and not putting any effort into school or in to the business and for Sodam being like "You should be friends for me" ugh
What you wrote was very very comprehensive and kinda complicated and I agree with somethings and not with some but one thing I absolutely agree is " people tend to forget any red flag the bottom has but when the top has the slightest flaw, he is thrash and garbage like ??? He is a PERSON too." Specially in the present times and past few years.
I mean, i dont care the sexual past of Jaeha, he can do with his body whatever he wants, but everyone is missing why he is such a "hate atracting" person, he is insecure and selfish, he never thought of how everyone around he would feel about his actions or how that actions will have consequences on the people he "loved", he just though of himself all around, even at the end when they get together for real this time, he never really understand how he damaged Eunho.
The fact that his ex-wife told him that she was hurt because he never told her about his past or how he feel and that's why she choose to divorce him felt so real, but Jaeha never apologizes for what he does, he was a indiferent person who was so afraid to be hurt that he preferred hurting the other one, he never though of what his ex-wife, Eunho o Hyunjoon would feel or how they felt but instead he pushed is own perspective of how they would react and since it was hurtful for him, he just tossed them aside in name of "I love them, so I'm not worthy of them", that's bullshit, that's why I hated him all around, he needed therapy, and Eunho self-esteem. Jaeha always thought that Eunho was gonna be there when he call him, even when he didn't answer his call and change his number, Jaeha didn't think Eunho will fall in love with another person or forget about him just because the author wanted it that way, Eunho could have lived happily because time cures everything, the same with Jaeha, he would easily forget about Eunho in a few years like he did with Hye Sun, nobody is irreplaceable, but the fact that these people who hurt each other in a lot of ways still get together is what bothers me so much, Jaeha didn't suffer in terms of being loved, he was just afraid of being thrown away so he was the person to throw away others, Eunho was hurt so many times for a person who didn't care about him until he was alone and he was the only person behind him, maybe it was true love idc, but I still feel Jaeha needed therapy, he hurt Eunho so many times, if the places were reversed I'm pretty sure everyone would tag Eunho as a scum. Still, happy that Eunho find his "happiness" even tho it's not so realistic ヾ(☆▽☆)
Another thing, it was so funny how the author made other characters make excuses for Jaeha to match his mistakes and make him pitiful instead of Jaeha explaining why he was such an asshole himself because he was afraid (of being abandoned and for going out the closet I guess)
I mean, nothing bad of being afraid of those things but for God's sake, he was 30, he wasn't a child, even with that, having a mental issue isn't.an excuse to be cruel and awful to the ppl who care about you and its not an excuse for them to forgive you
And this is my third time reading it, the second in the remastered version and the "and if I become weak and run away again, you can just came after me, because I'll only RUN AS FAR AS YOU'RE WILLING TO CHASE ME." Is always rage inducing, like fk Jaeha, you should say that you will not run again and not expecting Eunho will go after you every time like a dog, that's just degrading AAaAAAaas it was supposed to be a romantic reconciliation but that phrase right there ruined it all, whatever, why I am so bother with this even tho I read it so many times? Is should get a life
SO TRUEEEE !!! i'm so tired of seeing trauma or a sad past as a reason to get away from their mistakes like even a person who has mental disorder is still accountable for their actions and doesn't give them a free card to treat others horribly. i don't like the way they're excusing jaeha's actions just because he's hurting and it's fine because it's not the seme acting like a bastard. the double standard is insane here. how can a toxic ml can't get away, but not a toxic mc. they'd be calling it a baddie character
How would you have written it differently?
would u recommend, im pretty sensitive and the mc doesnt sound likeable :(
The story deals with complex and messy human emotions, personally I think it's written well, not every relationship is straightforward and I like that these characters aren't perfect they have their own issues which humanizes them a lot more. I would recommend it simply because I like that in stories myself, but if you're looking for everyone being a boyscout I'd say that's not what this story conveys.
I'm not saying it's bad or not "human" enough, yes, that characters are human and complex, but at the same time they are very fictional, it this would happen in rl at least one of the characters would give the back at Jaeha or Eunho would never be for him every time. I also liked this history, after all I read it a lot of times, but I'm bothered by the fact that everyone "protects" Jaeha like he is a little hurt butterfly who has mental issues, again, having mental issues isn't an excuse for hurting others and that's the overall message of this history "it doesn't matter how much u hurt the ppl u love, they can forgive because ur mental problems", which is not true at all, and I have a lot of mental issues too, that's why it hits so near home
There are unfortunately a lot of people who don't communicate to sort out their problems a lot of them in real life, I don't know why you're assuming otherwise. You're correct in saying having mental issues is not an excuse for being a terrible person, but at the same time people in real life use plenty of excuses to explain terrible behaviour. It's something we see quite often. I don't think it excuses Jaeha, but I have seen a lot of people destroy relationships over not being able to tell their partners things and being too afraid to discuss things, not because they fear violence or retribution but because they fear the situation will change for them and they prefer the status quo. It doesn't make it right, but it makes it common and I like to see that part of the realism reflected in the work, as for people making excuses for him and forgiving him, everyone's different, I wouldn't forgive a cheater for example, but there are people who would.
Yeah u right, still, that doesn't make Jaeha better or more nice, he is just a selfish person which was my point since my first comment. Did i like him? No, would i prefer Eunho ended with another person? Yes, does this mean the story is bad? Nope, i dont know what was ur point in ur answers, i was just kind of bothered of why they were putting "slut Jaeha" as why he has a tendency to be hated, that is again, missing the point of the reality of his character and why the story is such a dragged out love story and that's also the reason why I said Jeaha needed therapy and Eunho self-esteem haha.
Yes, give it a try, if it bothers u too much just don't finish it haha, but sometimes reading something that has a thing u don't like makes u see it from other perspective
Oh sorry I was just trying to explain my take on it.
Omg exactly. How could you match my thoughts so well?
Exactly exactly. But I guess you call that the 'mc privilege' ? All the characters and many(most?) readers exhibit this. (Not me lol). There're always excuses for the mc and his behaviour....he is often 'understood' by others despite his selfishness etc....but such privilege is not for let's say a ML/top who might have the same reasons for being an asshole or for not communicating properly. At first I was like maybe it's just for this one but now I've noticed this countless times. Also, I liked how you mentioned that the talk about such stories being 'realistic' etc very much contradicts with the fact that there's so much plot armour(like excuses given by others on behalf of JH for e.g.) for the main character, who's more often then not a bottom. It was refreshing to know your thoughts.
The double standards are truly real.
Came here because of the author but im on my way to drop this at 16 chap. That fucking blonde dude Eugene gets in my nerves, he is a fucking creep and im so angry that Jooin does not do anything to that motherfucker, hate him, also, im seeing a lot of SA and im very triggered by that.
its a happy ending trust me, blondie isnt a problem at all
I don’t know if you kept going with the story but I think you should. Jooin and Mookya are such a precious couple start to end. Honestly a shockingly healthy and equal relationship with respected boundaries, trust and open affection.
And despite the brother’s red flag intro he doesn’t actually do anything rapey during the story, what we see in the flashback is the only time. I get the feeling there was an intention to make Jooyul and Eugene be some constant threat to Jooin but then the author realized that doing so would be a terrible decision.
This is legit one of my favorites you should keep going.
Men, i cried while reading this and it really hurt me seeing all of the comments hating on Hwan, it he is the most pitiful one in the manhwa. I mean, he was a kid passing through a hard time and he really never mourned, Chiwoo was like a rope for him to just get up, he was clearly in depression when his dad died, his mom just neglected him all the manhwa, she never, not even one time, put herself onto his OWN SON side, she never tried to talk with him (not even when he was a child) or making him go out little by little out of his depression, cause lets be clear here even if I'm overthinking, he was clearly in depression this whole manhwa, since he was a child and no one tried to be with him. He gave himself to Chiwoo, he console him, he cheered for him, love him but Chiwoo didnt tried to have a talk with him, he saw Hwan as this perfect winner of life perspective of Hwan when in reality he was in pain all the time. The first time they have sex both of them were drunk and he was overjoyed by the fact that Chiwoo like him back just to wake up to Chiwoo moving out, imagine that, you think you start a relationship with ur crush just to wake and seeing him leave you as like he just used you without any explication, Chiwoo really looked like he was rejecting him. Chiwoo never tried to get in contact with Hwan, he just accepted whatever he gave to him without giving him something in exchange. All the monsters that SA Chiwoo were made BEFORE Hwan knew that Chiwoo was the other contractor, when he realise he stoped doing them just to find out again Chiwoo leaving him and in their begining life of dating started caring about other gay without telling you (╯°Д °)╯╧╧. Thats just awfult, i really feel sorry for Hwan, Chiwoo wish was for Hwan to be with him but he left him always, Hwan wish was for staying together always with Chiwoo making him happy, now who is the really selfminded? Hwan deserved a caring mother more than nothing, if his mother really cared about him a lot of these manhwa never really had happened.
Sorry for the long comment and for my bad english, not my first language. Not sorry for Chiwoo tho, he can suck others dicks if he wants, just makes Hwan forget about him and find someone who really care about him like he do. (If someone tells me that Chiwoo cared about Hwan ☠☠, like he really started to worry when he saw that Hwan was CRAZY, before nothing, even when Hwan was visually impacted when he killed Jin or it was before? Whatever, but the first reaction of Chiwoo was break up with Hwan, like wtf?? Not a talk? Not asking? Not making up points? Not trying to understand? Like i understand that Chiwoo was sad about Jin but like, he didnt tried to make sense of the actions of Hwan, and even when the conflict started with Jin, he never tried to explain it to Hwan, he just protected Jin as if Jin was more important to him that Hwan, that obviously will trigger something, imagine that ur boyfriend LIVES with other person without telling you knowing that that person likes him and even more, put him before you (●'◡'●)ﾉ i will also go crazy)
MEAT RIDER DETECTED
Im am indeed ngl
I ain’t reading allat
my same reaction
no one won't convince me this ain't sarcasm over wise I m genuinely terrified
….ion think it’s sarcasm
Bffr. Hwan deserves it lmfaooo
fr the OP is tweakin
agreed. probably wearing rose tinted glasses LMAO
LOL
I agree 100%
Your opinion is trash like Hwan (づ￣ ³￣)づ
HAHAHA think whatever u want, in the end, this is just a smut manhwa, being garbage it's also a lifestyle
not the person writing a whole fucking paragraph and then just goes like "this is just smut manhwa" this is too funny lmao!! but on a serious note at least embrace the garbage lifestyle i'll acknowledge that
I mean, the fact that i wrote a whole paragraph for just a smut manga its fkng funny HAHAHA internet its like a home for garbage like me, tnk god, shame is to steal and get caught
Everything about this manhwa is so convenient for what the author wants, there is no development whatsoever for ANY of the character, the things they do are so out of place, nothing makes sense, i find the mc annoying, the ML so generic and with 0 sense of romance (even tho i like possesive violent characters with soft spots, here he just doesn't have a personality aside from those traits), the 2nd ML is just a decoration, he falls in love with MC from the air, MC is 15 years old but in his past life did a lot worse things that ML, he was just this kind soul out of nowhere, like, he killed all his brothers, slept with minors, was arrogant and selfish all along, so i don't see why is he so adamant to do the right thing this time??? They want to tell us that he is reflecting thanks to this life but i can't see that in the story.
THERE'S 0 ROMANCE HERE, they have no chemistry, none of the characters, they fall i love thanks to the plot armor, what a waste of time, also theres rape but they didn't manage it well, again, just plot armor, they don't even brought it again after that chapter.