Kiki's Topics (239)

me

Indeed!

Woohoo,yeah!

I too am tired of this kinda shit. Ughhh so heartwrecking. When side characters needs to deserve more.

UGH IKR but i get this feeling, that clueless childhood friend will get in touma's pants UGH UGH UGH

spoiler.....


















it will not be the senpai, it will be take.. he will break up with his girflriend and get together with touma..

Me too #－.－). I read and reread the summary and it's the only interpretation I get from it. I thought that perhaps sensei would have Yonezawa not be that into Touma...until that extra which shows he is so clearly into Touma and I just can't.

*RAGE*

I appreciate you for telling me, tho, and I half came to that conclusion myself, which is why I was so angry in the first place lolol. Ugh.

Only in a world were Taka didn't come back alive! It's weird 'cause I'm usually all for non-canon couples, but this time I really felt like he didn't stand a chance.

It's just a manga imso chill out ?

I'm aware it's a manga. Thanks for sharing ╮(￣▽￣)╭.

I agree man. All these ppl who are butthurt can't even rebut more than just mere dislikes and "it's just a manga" excuse.

Their tactic now seems to be "ignore what makes sense, keep repeating what they like to hear and drown out everything else"

Sure it's just a president

No but y'all buthurt and petty over something that isn't even real imso??? It's just a manga and you don't have to get worked up over it man I don't understand why you guys are making such a big deal out of it imso I'm native and so is my friend and We still found this really cute ???? Lol get yo "XD" face ass outta here this is fiction man it doesn't have to make sense gtg

What does an election and a manga have to do I don't ?????????

All I have done is use the "leave a reply" feature as it is intended -- to have a discussion. I'm not sure what evidence you have of anyone being "buthurt and petty" or "worked up" beyond us daring to hold an opinion that is different from yours. You are trying to make yourself appear more reasonable than others and it's not working.

The "this isn't real" position is a stupid one. Otherwise, why are you getting so defensive about something that "isn't real"? Why find it cute? Why enjoy it? Because you get real pleasure from it. Others will not enjoy the same things as you do. You can question it, but I can't take you seriously if you indulge in childish remarks instead of addressing any of my points. "I am native and I liked it" is not persuasive. (I did edit my original post so you can reread it...or just leave us "buthurt" ppl to suffer, whatever suits you.)

Bad fiction doesn't have to make sense but good fiction does. That's about as basic a standard as you can get. We may enjoy some works *despite* this flaw but it is a flaw. In some fiction the other elements may be so enjoyable that you can ignore the mistakes here and there. Some mangas are supposed to be really over the top, and that's fine, I can enjoy that too. But this manga relies so much on othering one of the MCs to such unnecessary extremes that I can't ignore it (in a way that happens IRL all the time).

If you can okay! I won't quarrel with you about it. I enjoy some problematic works as well. But I can enjoy those works *and* recognise what's problematic about it at the same time. I don't have to pretend there isn't a reason why others may have a problem with it. You can enjoy this manga *and* recognise that others have valid reasons for not enjoying it and that it's okay to express that, rather than to dismiss it as being petty.

Finally! Finally someone said what I wanted to say! hit it sister!

Way to shut them down! a big salute to ya

They didn't lol but okay ??

Lol ok ??? I'm gonna end this right here dude but like I still don't get why you had to say so much negative things about this manga bro like just get over it I don't understand why u have to make such a big deal out of it but ok I wasn't being defensive about it I just hate people who take something as simple as a manga into such a big problem imso??? This is like the 3rd time I've seen this and y'all fighting over fictional characters if you didn't have anything nice to say about it you could've just left it alone gtg

Just because you like it you just want people to stop talking about it's flaws? Why don't people leave this alone instead of cheap excuses to justify how they like to fap to it. That in itself is a bit suspicious. You can't rebut it at a conceptual level. Yet you unnecessarily get mad and you pretend like you're the logical one here by pulling out and saying "I'm gonna end this right here" blah blah blah. I think ppl below have said "yes u can enjoy it so long as you RECOGNISE it's flaws" and judging by so may ppl's comments these days, I think they've recognised it but are too butthurt without evidence that now everything is a denial game.why don't you let it go?

Man, u went down so bad

Dude I lowkey just said it doesn't matter and you just bring it back wyd dude

"It doesn't matter" my foot.

IM LAUGAHINF

Also I didn't mean didn't matter Kms I meant I let it go idk what I was doing yikes

why spam this manga over and over?

Would you say the same if it's a bunch of fangirling? If you have nothing of meaning to contribute to the discussion I don't see why you are being butthurt about these comments.

Just so you know... You don't need to kiss or face each other to have sex...
What they had wasn't even sex, was REPRODUCTION... Which is really difference in some way... Because you don't do it to feel good or because they have an urge... They do it to have children, and since they don't know about the human's body... For them, probably, they think that if they have sex the entire day they will be able to have children...

And by the way you wrote it... You clearly don't know about tribes...
Each tribe is WAY TOO DIFFERENT from the other...
There are tribes who openly accept people from outside, others don't...
There are tribes in Africa that abandon their children to die if they're sick, there are tribes who practice cannibalism, there are some Eskimo tribes where the women would kill their children if they can't take care of all of them...
So... I don't know why this manga is so wrong... Here in my country there are tribes who wants to know about modernity and learn other things and other cultures...
So... I think this manga was pretty normal...
Besides... about the mask on the airport... This is a manga... So reality don't exist here... So he can go with his mask wherever he wants, because that's yaoi logic for you... LOL

Basically this: (ps. Not mine!)

I'm saying that if you can't fit it into a six chapter story at the very least expand or phrase the story where romance and sex doesn't outweigh everything else. Also everything was "it was said that...." That's the point, it's so rushed and all the important parts about learning about a culture had no time to even show. Im not saying it should be some documentary style, but it didn't even reach the Wild rock manga level of showing culture and that is like the minimal base line. And all the "culture" there is just there to create some awkward comical moment, and making the Japanese guy feel awkward, like him fainting, him wearing a mask for no reason (even though the mask was gone for the rest of the chapters) or just a simple act of hugging while sleeping (there really wasn't much of culture to talk about any way.)
http://www.mangago.zone/read-manga/mother_s_spirit/mf/v01/c001/40/
http://www.mangago.zone/read-manga/mother_s_spirit/mf/v01/c002/5/
And even this
http://www.mangago.zone/read-manga/mother_s_spirit/mf/v01/c003/30/

And this is just another example of making him look awkward and down to the level of childishness of being this unlearnt primitive tribe person. If you watch 'meet the natives USA' tis a diff story and a diff representation.

Also, you said about showing of culture right? Then why was it just one sided? You can just write "they saw each other's culture," but when it comes to the manga, it's just modern, modern, modern. Where's the mutual exchange of culture huh? Saying one thing and showing another?

And suddenly from 'let's learn about new culture for prosperity' becomes the age old stereotypical mission of the tribe to 'find him a Japanese wife' because they are tribes. -.-

http://www.mangago.zone/read-manga/mother_s_spirit/mf/ef99ea066d132c2d2a2bf3ea0418474f_chapter-5/pg-5/

And also the "modern man" steps in and slaps senses into the "backward" tribal guy trope.

http://www.mangago.zone/read-manga/mother_s_spirit/mf/ef99ea066d132c2d2a2bf3ea0418474f_chapter-5/pg-16/


And the professor part is the most alarming thing. He sees their potential wasted just because they are living peacefully and sustainably in an isolated village? Plus he knew they exist and live in isolation but goes there just for the sole purpose of "developing" them and possibly illegally through his connections?
And him modernizing them is a bit confusing. For whatever for? Like its sustainable, they've lives for generations and I agree with Aqnam on this. Is there an impeding threat? Is there some sort of situation where they have to abandon their homes? Or do they need to enter the 'modern' job market? Yes change is necessary but what is he learning and how does it apply to the daily lives of his tribe? This is when all these important aspects are just rushed past with just a few words like, "oh he went to promote education" from the professor.


http://www.livescience.com/2640-ancient-tribes-modern-civilization-mix.html
Lastly this quote from this link

it takes an advanced culture to survive in this dangerous natural terrain. The only thing primitive is our notion that what we have is better and needs to be forced upon them.

____________

So basically, what is offsetting is that it generalized tribes and contact with tribes into awkward parts and comical takes of the manga without actually revealing aspects of the tribe itself. Does the tribe kill children? We don't know! And with that, we don't know the actual culture despite the characters stating that it's a cultural exchange. World building fail. From the hints the tribe seems fairly isolated, which also leads to the point that the author did not take into account of real life consequences of a deliberate encounter that the professor had made. There's a reason why India banned people from contacting the sentinelise. It's because of the risk of diseases, that we are immune to, getting passed on to the tribe and killing them by the masses. (Yes, this happened) also, deliberate contact has disadvantaged thousands of tribes and reduced these tribes from independent societies to state fund dependent households. Plus, the professor way of doing things is reminisent of how colonials dealt with tribes in the past and that in a sense... This,.. Is a very ignorant flaw. Yes it's a manga, but I think as readers we should be able to point out that much. Yes you can like it, but don't deny it and try to smooth it over.

In this case of a tribe agreeing to make contact to improve their homes, much could have been expanded upon why they want to do so and how. This would not only enrich the relationship between the main characters but also increase how the cultures mixing foster and strengthen their bonds. For example, they could emulate the surui Carbon project. Where tribes take up technological devices like Mac books, data loggers and so on to actually measure the forest's growth carbon intake and other data in a way that no modern scientist could. Through this, they sell the data to all sorts of companies nod in turn protect their forest, their homes from being taken away. If education is like that then that's great. I can imagine ryou and qaltaqa having fun over a project with the children and the locals. Imagine ryou teaching qalt how to use a datalogger or like demonstrating hygiene practices to the children together. Pretty cute and romantic isn't it? So although the story is there, the ignorance in parts makes the works patchy and lacking despite a stable blueprint being thought out. So yes, the groundwork is there and the romance is up to standard, but there is so much to be done that is left out. And this is why we comment.

Also, watch "Earth, a new wild" series for more. It's an eye opening series :3

Dude it's called suspense of disbelief, so the "it's not real" argument is legitimate. The laws and ideas of a fictional world don't have to be realistic because it is FICTION. also
P R O B L E M A T I C
LOL social justice is killing art and censorship is the weapon

The laws an ideas of worlds don't always haven to make sense but when it uses real life themes like tribal culture,,,, they have to be careful. Look, unless they are aliens from outer space or from a different dimension and have no resemblance to isolated groups of humans with distinct culture (like u know... Tribes), and it's the same thing for Arabian themed yaoi and Indian themed yaoi. The author can name it ababdida or norgyuela but if it's obvious that it's referencing an existing collective of ppl (here is tribes) it must be addressed especially if the author fucks up so that readers know that's a fuck up, not something to happily nod along to. So there are ppl who actually know this and are commenting about their analysis on how the author handled portraying tribes in general (even for a non-specific tribe) . So this means the "this is not real" argument fails in itself. Art and literature are one way humans discuss and gain new perspective on life. Yes even a tiny BL novel (if the same plot is reproduced) can reinforce pretty strong concepts about how we view situation. So depending on the type of books and the presence of self check systems within a community, the readers will gain awareness and he ability to decide how they read, analyse and what message theytake awayfrom the works. Artists can write what ever they want but that means readers will comment and discuss it as well . As I've mentioned earlier, we just put out the information so you can do what every you like with it (be a passive reader, like it, praise the author whatevs) and you can even discuss with me on a deeper intellectual and conceptual levels of this topic.. I don't mind. I don't mind if you mentally wiped your ass with my words. It's you and u are a responsible adult in charge of deciding info yourself. I just don't like it when ppl deliberately give one sided taunts to attack criticism (like your sjw and stuff). You can accuse us of being petty and censoring... But ISSIT really? Your attempt at deliberately coming here, posting insults without meaningful conceptual ideas
to shut down other's opinions seems to be more at killing art and censorship. What is are if there is not free discussion? Are we living in a world where proliferation of misguided baseless ideas count as free speech but just analysis and criticism countering those ideas isn't ? Wait... Trump got elected.... It seems we are. Well good luck

But how can you know that the tribe was based on real life?
This is a Yaoi Manga for God's sake!
And the reason is so rushed... is because the Manga wasn't successful... just a little bunch of Mangas actually have success... and those earn an anime for themselves like Junjou Romantica or Okane Ga Nai...
So you can't expect the author to write an entire Manga when they don't have money to do so... Be happy that the author actually could end the Manga...
I must have some 30 Mangas unfinished because the author had to cancel it... just like any other Manga in this industry...

Besides... the tribe was created by the author as well... so it means that the laws and rules of real life don't apply to this...
Is not based on some remote island or something like that...

Look, it doesn't have to be a specific tribe. The issue lies in how the notion of a tribe (any tribe) is portrayed in general. Theres little effort put into displaying what it generally means to be a tribe. Though tribe theme should be seriously entrenched into the story like in otoyomegatari or wild rock (which had a fictional tribe), or basically a tribal or racially themed manga, the shallow premise here don't hold because of how little the attention is given to developing it. And that is what makes me feel that the author, due to lack of awareness, kinda generalized that tribes in general have nothing of value to be represented apart from the occasional masks; without any unique tribal meaning; filling in as a comedic device. Also the ever present trope that there will always be this stubborn tribal character who says smthg 'wrong' and the modern person swoops in and slaps sense into them and the modern man gains respect. A similar trope in jet Li vs native Americans and more. Thou it's subtle here, it's still needs to be noticed. And the colonial attempts of contacting tribes? Let me just say.... The colonials goes to the tribe, takes a person or two back to their country without their original country's notice, teaches and treats they people they brought so that when the brainwashed tribesmen go back, they will tell them tribe how good the colonials are as agree to be colonised and be brought up like them. Which had disastrous results down history as most lose their independents ways of life, get dependent on state funds, get wiped out and all that shiet today (also colonials are usually part of a tea company so.... Not exactly part of their home government but are really rich and powerful) although the manga did not end badly, the first few actions are pretty similar to how then professor deliberately went to meet the tribe and "pulled somet strings" to get Qalt to Japan. And the artist probably wasn't intentional about this and probably didn't know any better. But its still an important point to note. Basically yea, I still think there are points worth noting and deem it overall... Just somewhat ignorant and ill prepared. I have made no claim that I want to control what authors write and also, I don't expect the authors to see this as well. This is just comments alerting parts that readers might overlook due to the art and it's light headed romantic plot line. I'm just stating what I think and im not forcing u to believe it. That doesn't mean that just because an artist's situation, the manga is omnipotent of all criticism and have readers on their feet and thanking it. No. It doesn't work that way. If said author is not immune to even this kind of feedback, then that doesn't make a good artist. So you can stop "talking in the author's stead" and maybe admit that you are biased towards comments like these because your rosy dreamland is ruined by other's freedom of expression? You can use this info however u like and decide with your adult mind. If you don't like it, solid supported arguments are welcomed or you can just see it as another comment and ignore it.

"So the dude is from a tribe so "undeveloped" that the modern Japanese man has to teach him how to kiss and have sex?" He didn't teach him how to have sex. He prepped himself and Qal clearly knew how to use his fingers and what "put it in" meant. He simply did not understand what "sex" meant at first but easily understood that it was what they did to "make children." However implausible it may seem that his tribe wouldn't kiss aside, Ryouichirou simply assumed that Qal didn't understand the meaning of a kiss, which wasn't the case as you find out later in the manga. Qal doesn't simply think he'll just kiss whoever. He wants to kiss Ryouichirou. Remember that Ryouichirou did not see the full drama, but Qal did. So we have no idea if Qal understood why the actors felt the need to kiss or not. He just didn't understand the custom.
"But human sexuality is not a modern phenomenon it is human. People will explore it, on their own, from childhood, because it is *biology* and innate." I'm asexual so call me a rare case if you will, but I've never been interested in kissing, and it is clearly a quite popular custom in real life. So the idea that a civilization may not kiss is not that unbelievable.

Accidentally clicked post, subject continued:
In fact, there are cultures in real life that do not kiss. Some find it strange, or even gross.

I agree that the mask thing was strange, yes so I agree with you.

As for the chairman. I think his zealous nature comes off bad, but it seems like the Lutah tribe felt they needed to grow but did not have the resources available. The chairman didn't do what most colonizing assholes would aka sending a bunch of their own into a foreign land to take it over. He offers a Lutah native education, covers all the costs of it, and allows the native to go back and start an education center on his own terms. He's giving the Lutah people the help they need to help themselves.

Here's some sources on the kissing thing:
http://www.bbc.com/earth/story/20150714-why-do-we-kiss

http://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2015/08/12/431664215/not-everybody-likes-kissing

Thanks for sharing the links. Interesting cases but still doesn't disprove my overall point about the extreme other-ising of Qal from the moment he shows up at the airport.

I went through your statement point-by-point. The only thing I didn't bother discussing was the mask. If that's "extreme other-ising," then I don't know what to say. It was stupid, yes, especially given we see no one back in the actual Lutah tribe wearing a mask, but not to the extreme that you're taking it.

whoever this anon is: you've made some excellent points in this thread. you've successfully articulated how this manga is problematic and it's not just 'sjws making a fuss over nothing' like some people commenting seem to think.
and i can this like this mange while acknowledging its problematic aspects *shrugs*