Judychan's Topics (52)

- Yeonwoo having another baby is already a side story, but novel only for now.
- Twins? The only twins are Grayson and Stacy. If you mean Pete and Cecil, Pete is 3-4 years older than Cecil. There is also a side story when they met Spence the first time, but also novel only at the moment. But Pete appears in Kiss me if you can.
-Josh and the baby Daddy (Chase) that their own novel and a manhawa adaption which is on hiatus right now.
- Dane the extreme /dominant omega fireman who normaly tops, is paired with Grayson (who at the moment works as a fireman too.:D), who's webnovel is ongoing at the moment.
- The other two Miller brother will have their own novel in the future.

Thanks.

I know there is more stuff in the novel with some of the answers. But I need it in manga form because I do not have to time to hunt down the novel and then find time to read it.

Does Yeonwoo have a boy or girl?

I didn’t know they weren’t fraternal twins but siblings of different ages. In the manga the look like the same age. It’s alluded to that Cecil is a cross dressing boy. Is this true. It seems like they Cecil is jealous of Pete spending time with Spencer. Do they both have crushes on Spencer? What’s the deal? Chase was with Abigail who was Keith’s rotation girlfriend right? But Abigail is Beta right? So Chase swing all ways, right?

I didn’t know Grayson had a twin.

I read that Josh was with one of the Miller brothers. Pete and Cecil are their kids right? I guess Pete was the Josh was pregnant with when he first met Yeonwoo. What is the Manhawa with them.?

Is Dane (not Jax ) on par with Keith as extreme/dominant alphas? Isn’t Grayson an Alpha too? I am very interested in this side story

Who are the other Miller brother? Are you taking about brothers of Chase? Or Pete and Cecil? Does it involve Spencer?

I am interested in Emma and the newbie she was having a hard time with. I don’t know why we cannot get it in one managa.There is this one Manga which has gone through two generations. I read most of it before I lost interest because it didn’t make any sense anymore. But with this story all the side stories make sense to everything that happened between Keith and Yeonwoo.

That wasn't mentioned, most likely in the coming side stories.

You know that "Kiss me of you can" has a manhwa adaption? It's on a longer hiatus right now. There you see that only Pete exists, and he looks ~2-3+ years old. https://www.mangago.zone/read-manga/kiss_me_if_you_can/

Cecil, that he crossdresses is Josh and Spence's fault. Josh likes to dress Cecil in cute clothes, because he looks a lot like Chase. And Josh had a crush on Chase when he was in a commercial when he was a kid, dressed as a little girl.
When Spence met Pete and Cecil the first time, he was visiting Josh with Yeonwoo. He mistook Cecil for a girl, and iicr talked to him in a motivation way, when he was struggeling with that kind of clothes. Actually for Spence Pete was a prince and Cecil a princess. At least that strange meeting made the Miller kids taken with Spence.

Are you confusing Grayson with Chase? Chase is "Joshua-Sexual"^^, the only person he ever had sex with was/is Josh.

Pete and Cecil's extreme alpha father is Chase Miller, he is the actor Keith had problem with. Josh worked as his bodyguard. Pete was conceived a few year earlier, when they worked for Chase Miller before.
I linked the manhwa above, it takes place around the same time as Kiss me Liar. You'll see Pete there, Spence isn't even born.

Dane is an extreme omega (like Keith's father Angel and the Millers father Koi), readers who followed the author knew that for years, because he was planned for Grayson's story.
Extreme omegas have controle over their pheromones and can be easily mistaken for a beta. They can even knock out extreme alphas with their pheromones.
Grayson is an extreme alpha, he is even worse off than Keith, because he was born that way, so he can't feel emotions and can't understand emotions. His father made him learn to read emotions of others and try to imitate emotions. Dane is trying to teach him now.
They have their own webnovel (Desire me if you can), it is ongoing in korean at the moment.

Chase's siblings, in order:
-Nathaniel: male, extreme alpha
-Grayson: male, extreme alpha
-Stacy: female and Grayson's twin, extreme alpha
-Chase: male, extreme alpha (the only one of the extreme alpha siblings who presented late and always had emotions)
-Larien: female, extreme alpha
-Bliss: male, extreme omega

I don't know, the author hasn't planned any stories for the females, most likely preferes to write Bls.

Staying with an abusive partner because of poverty certainly is a "trade off" that far too many people have to deal with in real life. Providing for your partner monetarily doesn't make it okay to abuse them though. When Dan asked for emotional investment JK refused anyway so he's not Dan's boyfriend to begin with.

So you think that being forced to trade sex for basic comforts of life like having a bed to sleep in and not being chased by debt collectors is how MOST RELATIONSHIPS AND MARRIAGES are????? Good lord

well the last part i really disagree.

“dan consented to be in this kind of situationship” ur right to a certain extent. if a prostitute said they didn’t want to do it and u still did it that’s rape. monetary reasons doesn’t make it any less what it is.

consent can be withdrawn at any time. you cannot just buy the right to rape someone.

don’t worry kim dan was and is disgusted with the sex. he complies with it. yeah at some point he liked jaekyung and actually liked it but not anymore

to insinuate that relationships and marriages are bound by a contract or like prostitution or monetary exchange for sex or where consenting once means u consent forever is scary and false. idk what ur statement is trying to do

yeah in reality people rape people but normal people do not rape others. that is not just a simply fuck up one can take so lightly

Well said mate

Exactly

“This whole idea of having the perfect boyfriend who never f*cks up is some imaginary Disneyfied fairly tail that doesn’t exist in Real life.”
you are stupid as fuck. stop trying to justify jk’s abuse and rape towards dan just bc dan has suffered more previously. real relationships are not complying with rape in exchange for shelter (not to say it’s never happened ever). nobody is making it out like dan had it better before jk you’re just dumb. we’ve moved past that part of the story and dan still has a shitty life now thanks to jk. i hope you get out of that relationship you’re trying to justify to yourself through a shitty webtoon.

I mean, he didn't have much of a choice on the consent part to begin with. JK said, that first time: do it or don't, but gtfo if u don't.
And Dan NEEDED the money.
That is not consent in my books, he was pushed to a point where saying No meant more problem for him in the future. He was obligated, albeit indirectly or not explicitly, to accept it.
And he said he didn't like it, to stop ot slow down mamy times and Jaegeng never heard him out or his needs.
So yeah, I wouldn't say it is a "good trade".

And we can day that the only times Dan actually enjoyed the sex was when his needs were also met, when he was heard, or when he was literally drugged. :/

I agree somewhat with what you've said prior to those statements, tho. And no one can say Dan was better off before JK, of course, but he was left hollow after. His basic needs were met, but his mental health and his emotions where completely disregarded, and those are very, very important too.

Amen to this.
All the languages in the world and you speak in truth.

Never said it was ok. I said Dan’s life was no cakewalks before meeting JK. Like I said, people do trade offs IRL. I wish you stop romanticizing reality into some fictional happy ending. Nobody has a perfect life with the perfect boyfriend. I said JK is a POS. However he made some things better for Dan. That is a trade off people do every day and why should it be different in works of fiction. Stop being the moral police here with me.

Your definition of consent and mine are different. I take consent as being willing to give in. He wasn’t willing to give in with his other creepy boss. He took the hard road. With JK, it was a trade off. Is it wrong? Yes. But when you are at rock bottom, any goodness is a trade off for something better than the shithole Dan was in. I listed what the trade off was.


I know a lot of reader are young and do not have enough lived experience to give any informed opinion based on reality. They take what limited experiences they have and list some very laughable conjunctures of this and that regarding JK and Dan. Most of the comments are black and white opinions there isn’t even shades of gray. In reality real life is not just black and white with shades of gray. It’s technicolor. If readers have never had hardship in life. Then count your blessings because most people have some kind of hardship in life.

I stated that he has mental health issues. It’s a disease of the mind and body. There is no doubt that JK is a POS.

The reason why people are reading his yaoi is because JK is drawn beautifully. Not even Dan. Certainly grandma and I are taken by how attractive JK is drawn. I said this previously and people got mad at me for saying the silent part that nobody dares to say for dear of being attacked.

Look, I get people don’t like my opinions. It isn’t the usual JK bashing. I just speak my truths. People don’t have to like it. But it isn’t going to stop me from giving my opinion. Since everyone seems to be giving parroting opinions that they hate JK but keep coming back for more.

I really wish you rub two brain cells together and reread what I wrote. People like to choose violence with me whenever I give opinions that isn’t wrap in good vs evil/bad. My opinions are based in reality of what people are going through daily.

While you might be living in your fantasy ivory tower casting your own narrative into what I said. I wish you exert the same energy to learn what women sufferage is. It is still very much a thing. If you won’t like it then get off the internet and devote you time in combatting it in real life instead of being a keyboard warrior with your outrage.

Apparently, you have never been in an abusive relationship or have seen enough of the world to know that EVERY relationship is a trade off. While it might not be as bad as some of these mangas. No relation is steeped in Disneyfied fairytales. This is why people are getting divorced left and right nowadays. People really believe in that Disney shit.

You have never been in a rock bottom situation so you don’t know what little bit of lifeline is like. I stated what the TRADEOFF was that Dan had to better himself out of a rock bottom situation. There is a saying, nothing is free in life. What do you think would have happened to improve Dan’s life if JK didn’t enter it? He would have been raped by the loan sharks. He most likely would be killed by them or died with no place to live once his shithole apartment got demolished. With Dan dead, Grandma would surely die. THE END.

Do you see you dumb your comment appears to me? You have no gripe on reality.

If Dan had said not. Then it’s nonconsensual. If a sex worker said no. It’s nonconsensual and it’s rape. Withdraw consent with no and stop is rape to me. Did JK tape Dan? Yes. Did Dan consent to being in their situationship. Yes. I don’t see everything so black and white as you do. I take everything in context and the law. If you’re beefing with me about consent. Then we just have different opinions about consent. This is why rape cases are so hard to prove. I mean we have a sitting president in America with multiple rape charges. One of the rape charges come from his first wife Ivana. She said no and Donald Trump raped his then wife Ivana Trump. A sitting president has multiple rape charges in he double digit and yet not one conviction. It is because men think once consent is given it can never be taken back. When the letter of the law is a No is a No. and a stop is a stop.

Marriage is a found contract. You need a certificate to prove you’re married. With that certificate, you to abide by laws and rule with that contract (certificate). People need to stop romanticizing marriage. It is a shackle on women and some men. There are men all over the world who rape their wives because of that marriage certificate. Are you think ignorant to what marriage and domestic relationships are? There are laws and rules governing common law marriages and domestic relationships. Look it up. The internet is free. Don’t be this dense when you come at me.

If you don’t know that women married men for money than you need to know women were allowed by law to open their own bank accounts with lines of credit in 1974. To his day, men out earn women. Look at how many men are billionaires o pared to women. F you don’t think money is involved in marriage than you’re being dumb as a rock.

You’re dumb as a rock. I cannot help it if you lack real life experience and your reality is based of fairytales. You clearly lack two brain cells to understand what I wrote and come at me with bullshit opinions. I never said Dan and JK were in a RELATIONSHIP. I clearly said they are in a situationship.

I never said JK didn’t rape Dan. I said Dan consented to being in a situationship with JK. He was at rock bottom. JK made some improvements in his life and the trade off was JK being a POS. If you have low comprehension. I suggest you exercise critical thinking.

If JK didn’t enter Dan’s life, he would have been raped by the loan sharks. Killed or died from lack of money and shelter. Grandma would have certainly died. That would be the end of this story. The way you are being a violent crybaby is unhinged.

Cherry picking Dan’s life is you being extra dumb. You want to skip the part about how shitty Dan’s life is before JK. You might have moved past it by being flippant. Yet the author brought back Dan’s childhood just a few chapter ago. You see how you like to gloss over important parts of Dan’s mental state. I detest stupid dumb fucks like you who lack a lick of sense. You like to cherry pick narratives into black and white, good and bad bullshit. Clearly, “idiot should be your middle name.

my entire reply got deleted but let me just say you are seriously pessimistic in terms of marriage.

and to use the normalization of marital rape (which it isn’t the majority at least in first world countries like the u.s. though i’m sure more prevalent in third world countries and yeah i looked up sources) as justification to argue dan’s life with jaekyung is better than before and jaekyung is not so bad as people make him out to be is… smth.

look you can have your opinions on whether dan’s life is better with jaekyung or jaekyung isn’t so bad of a person compared to others, but your reasons come from a skewed negative perception

reread my comment a little slower. maybe you’ll understand what i’m saying and what parts of your shit take i was responding to dumbass.

just wanna correct u since consent's definition isnt an opinion. what your "definition" of consent is sexual coercion, which is illegal and is rape. "giving in" is not consent, its being pressured.

What part of your low comprehension addled brain did not get me saying JK is a POS- piece of shit? I said his situation improved.

Dan was living is a shithole apartment. Then he moved into a luxury apartment with food, heat, a comfortable bed and no worries about rent. Would you say this is not an improve to of his situation.

JK beat up the loan sharks and paid off his debt. Now Dan does not have to worry about being beaten. Dan does not have to worry about the stress of the loan anymore. Is this not an improvement?

If Dan has stayed in the moldy cold apartment and is kept malnourished, he would most likely die. The place he was staying in was heading for demolition. Dan would not have a home. Now he has a home with JK? Is this not an improvement?

Dan’s career was nonexistent after his mentor/boss tried to rape him and blacklisted him. JK gave him a job. Dan liked the job. He liked it so much that he was willing to work extra hard to take care of JK. JK’s teammates praised Dan for being a good doctor. Did this not help Dan’s low self esteem and self worth?

Did JK not pay Dan a good salary to help with grandma’s hospital bills? Did Dan not have to worry about the hospital bill anymore thus reducing some of his stress level?

Despite JK being a POS, he still went to see grandma of his own free will. This boosted grandma’s mood. If you never had a sick family member in the hospital dealing with sickness and what happiness does for a patient, you just lack understanding of real life situations.

The way I see it is, Dan would have been gang raped by the loan sharks or by JK. There was no escaping this. I’m of the opinion that it is slightly less evil than with the loan sharks. The author had put Dan in precarious positions to be sexually assaulted.

You are an idiotto not see any of this because you have tunnel vision of JK being a sexual predator. I know JK isn’t a good person to Dan with his sexual proclivities due to his jinx. Again, I acknowledge that JK is a POS. But what you fail to acknowledge is the improvements Dan had with JK. When people say critical thinking is a lacking skill in America, you and the people who are arguing with me should all get into a group photo to be poster children for it.

And I stand by that JK isn’t the worst piece of scum there is. You just want to make him he ultimate villain. You don’t like it that I don’t paint as such. You want JK to be the perfect person for Dan. When in reality, nobody who is a POS does a complete 180.

Like I said, Dan had a trade off of improving his life with JK. You might not like it but this is the story. You signed up to read it with your narrow minded POV.

And yes, i think marriage is not a good thing. If you’re sold on it being a good thing. Then good for you. Not everyone have to see marriage as the ultimate goal in life. I just do not like contracts governed by law for people to want to be together. Make no mistake, marriage is a registered contract in the form of a marriage certificate. Marriage is mostly in favor of men in the relationship.

how do you still not understand what ANYBODY is saying to you

Every sex act in a sex session needs consent. If you’re not into oral and someone forces you to do it, it’s rape, right? If you’re not into anal and someone forces anal on you, would you consider yourself raped if you agreed to other sex acts during the sex session?

Look I have been in sexual situations with coercion and pressure. I have said no and yes in different situations. If I said yes, it is consent. If I said no and the guy still forced his way, it’s rape. You want rape to be perfectly define and it isn’t. This is why rape cases are so hard to convict. Look at the stats. People expect things to be black and white and rape isn’t a black and white issue. Consent isn’t black and white.

If you think about it, all sexual situation have some form of coercion or pressure. It might be described as seduction. But in order for people to have sex, someone has to get the other person in the mood to have sex or do certain things while having sex. If you cannot convince someone to have do it with you. Then it’s nonconsensual. Rape can happen with couples, one night stands, FWB and spouses. Anytime one party says no, the sex act needs to stop. I never said JK didn’t rape Dan. What I said was Dan consented to be in the sexual situationship with JK.

I said what I said and you don’t like that I don’t agree with you. This is why you think I don’t understand. You want me to be a sheep and agree with you and the other’s opinions. The fact that I gave a full explanation and you still think I don’t understand “ANYBODY” just shows how narrow minded you are to want to FORCE me to contort my POV and opinions that are not aligned with yours.

Again, it shows how addled minded you are.

I’m out. People like you want to be these savior moralist with your narrow minded POVs that is steeped is Disney fantasies. It does not have a good base on reality. The fact that you are so pinpoint on JK and missing the whole context of the story just shows, people like you live in bubbles with rose tinted glasses. In the face of adversity, you would crumble and cower in the corner.

the way you just ramble and ramble and make up entire narratives in your head just bc people are telling you your take is flawed is so weird.

u have some valid points, which are again ur opinions, but ur reasoning and the way u connect these is seriously biased and comes from a negative pov.

and the fact that u keep saying consent isn’t black and white while giving perfectly good examples of black and white situations is throwing me off. it’s either consensual or not what is confusing you?

I mean it’s kinda comedic ╮(￣▽￣)╭

huh...? dude it's about the story and the plot. And emotions. Don't you get the concept?

I get the concept of these kind of mangas. They are very well written in the most toxic ways to engage rage with the readers. It’s the way it hooks y’all. If you as a reader, do not like these kind of characters, you must start reading these mangas. Do not support these kind of mangas if you hate the ML for being fucked up. Do not support these kind of mangas if you hate the MC for being weak. No support by not reading these kind of manga is a guarantee way to stop more of these types of manga. Not coming to an illegal sites of these mangas to bitch and moan because the writers are not going to see it. Or are you and the other whiny little biatches not getting THIS CONCEPT. If you are here reading it, you’re just as fucked up as the ML and do not have the self awareness to know this. At least I know why I am reading this. I want to see what other fucked up shit the MC is enabling the ML to do. Much like how the whiners are enabling these kind of managa by continuing to read and engage with the manga to boots its popularity on this site.

may this kind of love find you!

They are probably a child bro don't wish something like that on anyone

I’m crying omg

This is ragebaiting 4000

Not looking for love at my age. So I give your your kind wish back to you.

I am probably 2x your age so I can love whatever TF I want.only kids and adults with undeveloped minds talk this fictional shit so seriously. Grow the F up or leave this story. Stop being such a hypocrite with your stupid rage.

You know you’re a double hypocrite. You rage against this for a fictional character but wish it on a real person. And you’re laughing about it. You do know that your thinking is more twisted that JK’s right. You see what a bunch of rage idiots you are. I can point out the obvious toxic behaviors you think you are better than JK. You twisted minded fool.

I speak the truth and it butthurt some people who think they are better than JK. At least HK is a fictional character. But these fools are being her biggest toxic hypocrites to wish this kind of shit happen to a real person. Yet these fools all think they are better human being and put out false moral orutrage. If people hate the story so much. Just stop reading. But they won’t because they are not only morally corrupt but the the worst kind of double hypocrites. I would laugh if they weren’t such twisted minded fools.

I'm replying because I think this is directed at me (?) lol, so let me clarify: I didn't "wish this kind of shit" to happen to you. Your comment literally talks about how you love Jaekyung so much and his toxicity.

> "JK is so hot being toxic and I am here for it all."
> "I am with grandma here thinking he’s he greenest flag that it makes me blush"

You even say in the second sentence that how he acts is considered as a "green flag". Not to mention your topic is literally titled "I love". You really seem to love the word "hypocrite" yet you act so ironically. If you don't get what I'm trying to say here you should do some thinking and reflect a little before you reply

Yes. I love JK because he’s fictional. I like my fictional character to be hot as hell and toxic as hell. You know not everyone needs to hate the fictional characters you supposedly hate yet keep coming back to read it. You know deep down you like JK because why else are you here. I can separate fiction from reality. You’re being a hypocrite if you say you bitch about him and come back. And do not gaslight me like I am a kid. I am a full grown adult twice your age. I know when someone is fucking around and wishing me ill. Do not fucking try to be the bigger person my making it seem like it’s a joke you wish that shit on me. You get to fuck around and play victim with your innocent act. Don’t pull your holier than Mary crap on me. I have see through professional bullshit artist and you’re doing amateur hour here with this walk back and making it seem like it’s am the dumbass when it’s you that is stinking this work of fiction. You’re being a came here into my comment with pick me energy thing your were right. You have your posse of clowns who made you this stupidly fearless to do a walk back with me. Little girl, you need to crawl back into to your mom and be reborn again if you think I’m misunderstood you in any way. GTFO here.

When have I ever said that everyone needs to hate Jeakyung? It's a known fact that he's toxic but are you saying because people dislike a character in a story then they have no right to continue reading? Actually, it's frankly non of your business why people want to read or continue this story but if I don't tell you, then you'll just keep creating crazy assumptions No? I read this story because I find it entertaining and amusing to read. So I hope I've cleared that up. Also, I don't appreciate you trying to change the subject. Most, if not everything you just said sounds to me like you were just ranting on a discontinued argument that you had with someone else.

You say you only like Jaekyung because he's fictional and you like your fictional characters to be hot and toxic as hell but then you also say "Good looking people are allowed to as toxic as they want and I’ll eat it up every time". I'm actually literate and it's clear that what your saying here is that ANYONE who looks good is ALLOWED to be a piece of shit and you'll still glorify them. Now that we're back to the topic, It seems you didn't get my point at all in my previous reply so I'll just tell you now: You love Jaekyungs character so much even while aware of how toxic and horrible he is, yet you got so offended and mad when I said "may this kind of love find you" You love to call people hypocrites when you're one yourself. "Wishing me ill" "wish that shit on me". You clearly acknowledge that what Jaekyung does is wrong yet you still admire him. Again, just another one of the instances of your hypocrisies

And lastly I don't believe your a "full grown adult twice my age." I'm not asking you to show or give me evidence that you are. Your spelling and grammar are really off and you focus more on giving insults and cursing rather than trying to prove a point. Your mindset also very contributes. My point is: start acting like the "full grown adult that's twice my age" that you claim to be. This time I really hope you try to comprehend and understand the things I've said instead of just immediately replying.

Why do you think the comment was addressed to you except you are outing yourself. People like you with your pick me self importance need to get over yourself. NOT EVERYTHIGN PEOPLE SAY IS MEANT FOR YOU.. Except you thinking too highly of yourself. You know how many people bitch about hating JK and this manga. They know I am not talking to them. Because they don’t give a shit. Unlike you. You fucking take everything personally to you and only you. Stop being such a self righteous, self important, delusional, POS. While you’re at it, Stop being such a fucking killjoy in the common section. There is a way to give constructive criticism. And then teach you. Being a little whiny ass bitch. Fuck off. Get a fucking life. Stop trolling the common section And think that everything people say that you disagree with is addressed to you personally. I get that you have no life. You have too much time on your hands. I don’t and I am done with this conversation. The next time you wish something shitty happens to a person who you have never met on the other side the screen, You need to check yourself. You are saying that JK is toxic. Then what the fuck are you? You need to look yourself in the mirror and know that you are worse than JK. No one has ever told you this. I am here to tell you. You are welcome.

i agree you can like a fictional character who is outright a criminal amongst other things and it doesn’t immediately say something abt what you condone or find acceptable in real life but i also think its objectively hilarious to blow up like this over someone making one throwaway comment someone made about you meeting that character irl. like personally i’d have clarified that yeah i wouldn’t touch him with a ten foot pole if he were real but i’m on my knees sucking his fictional dick anyway, or joked around about becoming as morally degenerate as he is if i was, you know…self-aware.

It is always telling who are the mentally corrupt readers when they take a general comment with a personal attack. I clearly stated I might the only one who love JK as a I’m a work of fiction. I am not wrong to call out all the killjoys who constantly come into the comment section being the virtue signalers who cannot admit their twist delight in loving the manga with their purity thoughts. They are so weird to wish evil to a person they don’t know. Yet they think they are better than JK. Make it make sense for me. It’s not false that they like the toxicity of JK. He adds drama and spice to an otherwise boring story. It’s creative writing 101 to add conflict and drama to hook readers. If JK meets Doc Dan and he sweeps DD off his feet to live happily ever after. The story would be boring AF. It will be a one off or three chapter manga. Like these whiny little babies would then complain he story is boring AF. These killjoys offer nothing yet the pollute the comment section so I cannot find the good feedback with constructive criticism or give good spoilers. I have to shift through a pile of of bullshit to find the good ones who have insightful breakdowns. I feel sorry for people in general who have to deal with toxic killjoys who will kill you in real life if they can want a real person like myself to get into a real relationship with JK. These are scary people. They give the same energy of a wife beater who tells a woman he loves thst he is beating her up for her own good. Scary people who can knife you in he back while smiling Tom people as they are doing it.

…so idk where to start.

yeah, i’d generally say wishing someone harm is bad, but i’m also like, idk, depends. i’d probably tell someone to kill themselves if they clapped and cheered about a transphobic depiction of a trans person in fiction, for example. but also, comparing someone merely wishing harm on others to someone like jaekyung who actively rapes and abuses, or people who kill is…certainly something.

anyway i don’t think i saw where this person claimed they were better than jaekyung. and i also don’t know why you people immediately default to say that anyone who doesn’t like the webtoon or doesn’t like jaekyung must just secretly be fans…is it that hard to conceive of people finding his actions reprehensible? you’re the one saying that this person wishes you harm by merely wishing you find someone like jaekyung IRL…so you agree, his actions are harmful. some people will look at that and not be a fan of him—it doesn’t mean they don’t like or enjoy the story overall. they might even like his character and how he’s written but dislike him as a person.

personally, i of course dislike him as a person, and i also dislike the way that he’s written. pretty emblematic of what toxic masculinity and an abundance of power can make of a person, which i find interesting, but it does not otherwise make him compelling as of yet. he feels more like a caricature to me more than anything else a lot of the time, rather than an attempt at creating a more well-rounded, human-feeling character.

fiction writing 101, lol. yes, conflict is a core part of storytelling. but there’s all kinds of different conflicts characters can have with each other, and all kinds of different ways an author can go about writing and resolving that conflict. even that scenario you described where jaekyung and dan get together right away can have conflicts that have little to nothing to do with the two characters being toxic to one another, and can still make for an interesting story. just off the top of my head, let’s imagine a jaekyung who isn’t a complete and total asshole…his fame alone could be a point of conflict that puts strain on a quickly established relationship between himself and dan, where now dan has to deal with the stresses of being in a relationship with a famous person. like him no longer having any privacy, people scrutinizing his every action/their relationship with each other, people sending him negative messages because he’s jaekyung’s partner…maybe you’d even have dan comparing himself to jaekyung and struggling to see why jaekyung would choose to be with him over someone of jaekyung similar social standing, him feeling like he doesn’t have the same accomplishments to boast of and feeling inadequate…

obviously that’s a different story from this one and the author didn’t need to write that kind of thing for this to be a good story but, well. idk. i think i lost my own plot, lol. i mean basically, the characters don’t have to be wildly toxic for them or their story to be compelling. and just because a character is wildly toxic doesn’t automatically mean they’re complex or well-written. maybe YOU might find that type of story less interesting, but i think it’s a stretch to say that people who dislike jaekyung as he is now would find a different version of him boring.

I am 100% sure that I am a lot older than most of you are who are reading this unless you are in your 60s. I have seen stuff before things during my lifetime. Before toxic behavior was all the rage in call outs. Especially now on social media as toxic masculinity. I know that I am a lot more evolved than a lot of the readers here. I might not like someone, but I never wish them ill will just because I don’t like them. I want to call out people and have to be made self aware of it. How they need to be told shit their pare at anmd life should have taught them. So they can reflect and change their toxic behaviors. People are so easily triggered by things because people put themselves on a self importance pedestal. When in fact it is a none of you damn business pedestal. There are many people who are commenting on not liking JK. This is all fine if you just want to call JK out for his toxic behavior. I read through those, and I have no issue with it. I even agree that JK is a POS to Dan. But he’s still a well drawn hot AF POS. The ones I have issue with is calling out his toxic behavior, then saying that they are done with him. Yet, every time a new chapter comes out they are in the comment section again. Callling out things that, we as readers have clearly read and decided that we want to continue reading this manga. Those are the hypocrites I am talking about and peole like that always out themselves whenever I go into the comment section taking a piss about it.

I clearly stated that I know why I am reading this manga. It is because JK is drawn to be beautifully handsome. I want to see what he’s going to do next that people are enabling in the manga. He’s doing the most fucked up shit because people are allowing him to do it in the manga. This is also true in life. I work in the fashion and beauty space. This is absolutely true in life. Was Alexander Wang being the most Toxic POS, raping models, who are drunk or drugged up? Did people in the fashion industry, know of this and allowed it to happen? Was he called out for it? Was he cancel? The answer to it is no. He is still out there giving interviews now like it’s no big deal. How do you think Joel Epstein was able to get away with human trafficking, rapist attending his sex parties with the women he traffic? Do we not have in America a sitting president now who is a convicted felon on top of being a piece of shit. He’s been accused of sexual harassment, sexual assault, and raping. Yet people vote him into office! This is the space I am coming from when I say that are hypocrites.

People might be mad that I’m stating the obvious which is why people are so butt hurt to wish that I find a guy like JKto get into a relationship with. It’s laughable to me that this people are thinking like grade school kids in a sandbox. Throwing sand in my face. Like a five year old with no impulse control. And the most laughable irony is that they are saying that I, as a person who is 3x their age being called a child when they cannot see their own actions and what it means. The three people who are commenting on my comments are acting like a bunch of mean girls in high school who is just picking on someone just to get their jollies. Do you see how ridiculous these little butt hurt clowns are?

Again, I cannot emphasize enough. If you find JK to be so toxic and you have an issue with the writer, just stop reading. Do not support the authors in this kind of manga. This is a guarantee way to stop these kind of characters. But you, and all the three clowns who have commented are not going to start reading this. And there goes my proof that those 3 commentators are hypocrites. They are saying they hate these types of characters. Much like how you are saying you don’t not like this character being toxic. Y’all know you are reading this because JK is drawn so beautifully. As I had originally said. We do not need to keep lying to ourselves like we are better human beings by bitching about how much of a POS JK is week after week. How y’all are done coz none of y’all are done until he author says they are done.

i feel like you’re lowkey not even reading any of what i’ve said, nor are you really addressing any of it. then you’re also like, spiraling into tangents and topics that i’ve not even brought up with you, to the point where i’m k having trouble understanding what your point is. like i, personally, have never once brought up your or even my age. but i’m frankly beginning to think that the lady doth protest too much…i doubt you’re actually someone in your 50s or 60s or whatever, and if you are, man, idk…i won’t say there’s an age where you have to stop enjoying things, but doesn’t this feel a bit too juvenile to you? not only your response to these comments, but this webtoon overall? it feels too juvenile to me. but i guess i am here, too, lol.

anyway, yeah, to an extent it is true that jaekyung’s characters and actions are true to life. it’s absolutely true that part of the reason why he gets away with so much is because people enable him to do so—they might take issues with his behavior and call him out for it but let some things slide (jaekyung’s coaches) or they might not care enough to do anything about it at all (heesung) or they might see nothing wrong with what he’s doing at all. it’s also partially because, you know, if you’re someone like dan, or even someone like one of the members of jaekyung’s gym, you don’t really have the power to say no to someone like jaekyung for a variety of reasons. and there’s also the fact that he can act somewhat normal in front of people, as we see in the most recent chapter…he’s capable of doing good sometimes, lol, even though most of the time it’s for his own gain. i don’t really get what that has to do with people being hypocritical though?

and, again…there are all kinds of reasons why someone might continue reading this webtoon despite taking issue with aspects of it. honestly, i was done with it for a while because, yeah, i just…find it overwhelmingly cliche, but i’m still somewhat curious to see how it will end. i was also, for a time, trying to understand other people’s POVs when it came to this webtoon—both in terms of what they liked about it and what they hated about it, and see if i agreed or disagreed. and good or bad, any piece of art can be analyzed, and i like doing analysis and discussing (or debating) with people about it. i was not and still am not here because jaekyung is so beautifully drawn…personally, i find dan cuter and more attractive, i’m not a fun of super muscly dudes. the art is nice overall, too. but i was here more so for the plot/characters. the way you’re talking about it, it’s as if you see nothing good or worthwhile about this webtoon except “toxic man pretty.” nothing’s wrong with that, but it’s pretty telling if that’s the only thing you think people come here for…

i don’t care enough to say something like “i want this type of story to stop being written” or “the author should quit writing.” tbh i would be sad if the author quit because, no matter how bad i think someone’s art is, i think they should keep making it anyway. and i don’t find her stuff harmful enough to say that, either. i never said i had a problem with jaekyung being toxic—the issue is that he’s toxic AND he’s not written well. it’s natural that i dislike his personality and his actions…but i might still appreciate him as a character. but i don’t, not really. like i said, he’s interesting, but otherwise…if he were toxic and well-written we’d be having a whole different conversation. all i said was that it’s possible to write a compelling story with complex without the characters being wildly toxic to one another, and that just because a character is toxic doesn’t necessarily mean they’re well written. this was in response to you saying stories need conflict and that people would take issue with jaekyung if he WEREN’T toxic…

related but unrelated, what do you think about luigi mangione killing that one healthcare CEO?

I read what you said. And a lot of points you are saying, and then you are contradicting with the IDK to play the devils advocate in your arguments. I try to make heads or tails, but what you said. You even said yourself that you don’t even know what you’re talking about in your comments. Do you not understand that you have very little coherent thoughts in your response to me and I was trying to figure out what it is that you’re trying to say and this is my interpretation of it clearly you do not even have a clear thoughts of what you are trying to say. Whereas I have stood my ground from the very first to your comments. I have said that if you do not like toxic characters in a fictional manga, They simply don’t read it. The simple thought that get across to you.

Yes, I know that you did not bring up my age. But if you follow the threat of this whole conversation, you can see that my age was brought up. And I am telling you and other readers that I have years on you. And the simple fact that you cannot wrap your head around a clear point of you too again like all the other commenters invalidating my point of you by saying, you doubt my age. Yes, this is how someone who have life experience and a solid point of view will talk to you Because you and the other commentators have yet to live the life experience that I have, you are rambling. Reread what you had wrote and think of it as reading from someone who is writing if that’s not you and see how I have address your point of view to make sense of things. You just do not like my point of you so again, you are invalidating it because you expect a certain answer, and I did not give you the answer that you expected.

You want me to be wishy-washy with my point of view like you are with yours. I did not give you that so you think I did not read what you wrote. You wrote a lot of things about rewriting the whole story of this manga. If that was the case, then people would not be in the common section being all pissed about how JK is. And this is what irks you and the other commentators. That I have a point of view of JK stay exactly how the author have written him as. I have no Issue with a character written with a lots of toxicity or masculine toxicity. You and the other commentators have a big issue with this type of character. You want to change the whole entirety of the character that the author have conjure up. Do you know how ridiculous it is to me to read what you said? You wants a complete different story than what the author has put out. You wanted me to point out this and agree with you that Jk should change. I wholeheartedly do not agree, which is why I just brushed it off. And this is why you think I did not read what you wrote. When the person does not want to address a point of view that you have it, does that mean that the person did not read what you wrote. And if you have more life experience than I have, then you would know. People like me who have left decades know how to do diplomacy. You as a young kid do not know when someone is being graceful, and not tearing something that you hold value into shreds. One day when you get to my age, you would realize that your opinion about what you have written to me it’s very foolish and did not age well. When you have that aha moment of having lived experiences, you will see everything I have said in this comment thread is true.

Clearly, I am having a silly argument with silly people With silly expectations of how I need to behave in the comment section. It’s always ridiculously funny to me how people do not want to be coming to policed. Yes, you like to be the comment vigilantes. You want to shame people to the point that they shut the fuck up that is your acts of vigilantism. So for this, I am done and I am just gonna fuck off because this is a waste of my time.

alright, let me clarify what i mean when i say i’m struggling to understand your points. it comes down in part to just the way you type, i’m gonna be honest. your punctuation is all over the place and/or non-existent. many of your sentences are fragmented and/or grammatically incorrect. sentences like “And a lot of points you are saying, and then you are contradicting with the IDK to play the devils advocate in your arguments” and “And the simple fact that you cannot wrap your head around a clear point of you too again like all the other commenters invalidating my point of you by saying, you doubt my age,” for example, do not make any grammatical sense, and it feels as if you are jumping from one idea to another within one sentence without any clear or smooth transition into it.

and when i say i feel you’re not addressing my points, what i mean is that you’re not addressing ME. you’re talking to me, but then you’re also shadowboxing other people who have made points that i simply have not made. i’ll clearly tell you if i like or dislike something you have to say, that isn’t the issue here, and i’m not trying to avoid anything. it’s just that, again, i’m struggling to keep track of the conversation when your grammar and syntax is in the way AND you’re also discussing points i hadn’t brought up. like your age. and to be clear, i don’t actually give a fuck how old you are. a kid can make a good point and an adult can make a bad point and vice-versa. i just think if i were in my 50s or 60s, me PERSONALLY, i’d want to be engaging with things more worthwhile than this. me as a 23 year old right now, i’m bored and procrastinating doing more important things. lol.

girl ur the one who said you loved it so why tf are u coming for me? ur a mess tf

genuine question by the way, do u need mental help?

anyway, i think i’m quite coherent. it’s just that i’m applying nuance where i think nuance is fit to be applied. not everything is black and white. i think people are free to read or watch something whether or not they like or hate it, for example—i think it’s stupid to say otherwise. tell me precisely where i’ve outright contradicted myself, though, and i’ll address it.

i said on ONE COMMENT i made to you that i lost the plot and it was because i was getting bogged down in brainstorming an alternative plot, which i was using as an EXAMPLE that, again, you do not need wildly toxic characters to make an interesting story. that was in DIRECT RESPONSE to you saying that the people who hate jaekyung right now would find him BORING if he were a different type of character. my point being: no, not necessarily.

if you like jaekyung the way he is, that’s fine…can you point out to me where i said that YOU have to dislike the way he’s written? because all that I’VE said is that *I* do not think he’s well-written. can you point out to me where i said jaekyung needs to be a whole different character, that this webtoon needs a whole different plot, or that you needed to agree with me on either of those two things? no. again, the alternate plot idea was to demonstrate a different point. i said i found jaekyung’s character as is to be interesting in some ways, but otherwise flat. and i don’t give a fuck if you agree with me or not on these things. if you do, you do. if you don’t, oh well. this isn’t a difference of opinion that’s worth chasing.

i don’t actually think jaekyung’s character needs to change all that much to be more compelling. and i can’t say for sure what would or wouldn’t help, given that the story isn’t finished yet and i can’t evaluate the full scope of what the author is trying to do with him. the issues with jaekyung’s character don’t even really stop at just him, either. but really, all i think i would’ve like from jaekyung is a little more range in behavior and emotion—or at least SOME contextualization of the way he is now in order to humanize him a bit more. moments where he displays some emotion other than annoyance, rage, or smugness. moments where we, as the audience, can at least see some HINTS at how and why he became the way he is.

we know all about dan’s backstory and can thus understand some of how/why he acts the way he does. we’ve seen dan be both incredibly meek AND capable, every now and then, of sticking up for himself a bit. like there’s a moment in the webtoon where dan is able to tell jaekyung to fuck off during sex for a brief moment so that he can go check on his grandma. that in and of itself gives us an interesting break in dan’s usual character—and at the same time the action feels in-character for him because we’ve already seen how important his grandma is to him, that she’s been basically the only parental/guardian figure in his life since he was a child.

up till now, we STILL don’t know shit about jaekyung. we hardly ever see these little breaks in his character. there are some! i will admit! but they pale in comparison to him carrying on very business as usual, being a piece of shit not only to dan, but a lot of the people around him. like we get these moments where he can act cordial around dan’s grandma and where he kinda backs down from his bullshit if his coach steps in to scold him. even in this recent chapter, we see him help out in this little town. it’s something, but these moments are few and far in-between…and we don’t have any context for this behavior, either. we can intuit that jaekyung seems to respect his elders/superiors, but why does he do that? is he like that because he had this respect instilled in him from a young age by the people around him? is it because there was an older person in his life who was important to him? is it just because of korean culture? without the context, its just…there. otherwise, he’s just being a self-serving asshole for what still feels like no real reason.