I feel like this would’ve been better if it committed to either being PWP or a story but it kinda flopped between the two. Cheolho’s story was actually really interesting. I feel weird about cuntboy fetish being a trans man, esp since I can’t even use that hole, but it’s still kind of nice to see a man with a vagina represented.
Early on Seunghyuk mentions that he doesn't remember who he lost his virginity to, that "at the time [he] was a little..." and then trails off... I'm assuming the implication is that he lost his virginity shortly following his grandmother's death bcus he was so out of it/needing company but it's a shame that it never came back up again/got closure.
Damn I don’t think anything could redeem the top lmao, this is just gross and brutal…
It reminds me of a lot of those popular darker het romances you see ppl rave about where the ML is sooo abusive and awful but is still the end game with the FL.
I kinda hate how obsessive seunghyuk was after they finally got back together… or at least I’d like to see them once they’re back to normal/not freshly broken up. The angst was delicious, though.
*freshly back together after breaking up
Sex work is real work. It isn’t selfish to enjoy your work and want to continue to do it. Issues of jealousy or possessiveness need to be talked out and resolved. Saying “quit your job because I don’t like how you use your body,” is unfair. Even if there are other work options. People shouldn’t stop having to do work they like just because of their partner. Because there are people who are fine with it, and there are people who understand this line of work, and people who understand that they don’t own their partner. And people who understand that sex for work is nothing like sex with a partner.
Support sex workers and support sex work! (๑•ㅂ•)و✧
NOOOO I STARTED READING IT WRONG AND THUMBS DOWNED BY MISTAKE
I was going on a path of disliking all the anti sex work comments, but you're so right with what you said
The thing that scares me is that the bottom is a pretty realistic depiction of someone who has been horribly emotionally abused for years and years, forced to become completely reliant on their abuser and isolated from the world, etc. Like. The author hits on even less talked about but very real aspects of escaping from and recovering from an abusive relationship.
And yet she... talks like the abuser is a good person? How? How? How? How do you write one of the most realistic effects of a toxic abusive relationship on the victim/survivor and still not realize? Or justify it?
Yeah. I'm waiting until this story ends. I assumed it would end with the bottom getting with the non-abusive character but my expectations have hit rock bottom.
Exactly!
I had the biggest ‘bruh’ moment
I mean considering what they personally likes no surprise. (grooming? TF?!!!)
And they’re gonna justify the abuse and grooming by giving us a cute lovely backstory on those two. Isn’t that just wonderlfull :D
I'm glad ppl are actually acknowledging this as rape since ppl got pissed at me for pointing it out last time ;; really makes me sad
… that was sa :(
WHAT WHEN?
ch33?
“could you slow down a bit?” “i said wait!” “that’s enough. i feel better now.” “we can’t do this here.” “[when asked if he wants to stop] yeah, no. we can’t do this. what if someone sees us?” “let’s stop for now, okay?” “just… not here” “wait!” “wait! wait!”
mc repeatedly asks ml to stop. when ml asked if he wants to stop he directly says he does.
Nah its not, he likes him and want to do all that with him. Dumbass
He literally tells him he likes him, and that he’s just embarrassed/shy to be doing all that. Not that he doesn’t want it
you know that most people are raped by their romantic partners, yeah? liking someone is irrelevant to whether or not it’s rape.
there is quite literally no way you can interpret “let’s stop for now” being ignored by the ml as anything else. If that is not what the author intended, then they accidentally wrote rape.
it doesn’t matter if he is “just embarrassed” he quite literally only asks the ml to stop. ignoring him asking to stop because he is “just embarrassed” is still rape.
He has arms and legs if he wanted out if that situation he could def left lol rApe ٩(๑❛ᴗ❛๑)۶
This is literally rape apologia and victim blaming… disgusting.
Sure cheating is wrong but I hope y’all in the comments never talk to a real abuse victim like this. Talking about wanting him to die and how he’s irredeemable trash, etc., it’s honestly horrifying.
right like um these mfs in the comments have no empathy
I'm sure they're underage or ppl who got cheated a lot who says that bullshit about the uke
Let’s not forget that this is a fictional story and MANY people separate how they react and feel for fictional characters vs how they’d act towards real people. Of course people would have less sympathy for a 2d character and easily be able to talk shit because he’s not real on the internet vs irl.
Anyways I don’t agree with the dying part but I DO agree that I believe mc is irredeemable in the way that I don’t think he deserves to get back with the good bf. He can heal from all the trauma, get some help, and STAY independent since that’s what he should be learning instead. It would leave a bad taste in my mouth if the incident was swept under the rug and he gets back together with the good bf.
-
Y’all can say whatever you want about empathy or abuse being the cause of his actions but it does not change the fact that he did a bad thing, realized it was wrong late, lied, continued doing it, and got angry at the bf for being questioned while he was lying. It doesn’t change the fact that the mc definitely cause the bf to have his own trauma because of him. The mc hurt the bf badly. There is no taking back the pain he caused. Having trauma can’t excuse his actions.
My only point is that he doesn’t deserve to be with ML for cheating on him. He needs therapy, not a relationship cause he clearly can’t handle it. He knows it’s wrong but can’t help himself, that other dude sucks the most and uke is trash for cheating but I can forgive if he gets therapy.
Cheating isn’t just wrong, it’s disgusting and pathetic to do. But since he’s a victim, I obviously won’t blame him too much but I also wont excuse his cheating and be done with him. I’ll stay as a friend and help him though. Cause he needs support.
The victim blaming in mangago comment section is always appalling. Don't expect much from here.
If they’re just saying he’s trash for cheating, not victim blaming. If they’re saying he’s trash that can’t be redeemed and how it’s all his fault, they’re victim blaming. I hate peoples like those. Yes Woojin did cheat and is trash for that and not a good partner, but I think he’s not evil and still redeemable. The only evil one is Minho, the one who caused him to be like that and trying to break apart his relationship. Anyone who thinks Woojin did it to himself, fuck them.
. I agree with everything you said.
I agree with u , since the uke hated his bf talking with a girl , he should hold himself back from cheating , especially cheating with the one who caused his trauma , but I think the uke have borderline personality disorder, he doesn't know how to think or how to deal with emotions , because they feel empty , they have some times when they can't breath and feel extremely scared , idk exactly how it's since I didn't read a lot about , but I think when he cheated he was in that condition, I'm not saying what he did was right
and I agree with u about not going back to his bf , because I feel bad for him, he's so nice and innocent , because I hate it when ppl with traumas cause other ppl traumas
Something important you are missing:
He isn’t doing things just because he is traumatized. You are talking like this is in the past. He is actively still being abused.
His ex-partner spent years grooming him into being completely dependent and reliant on him. It’s hard to break that suddenly and all at once. On average, abuse survivors return to their abusers seven times before permanently leaving. It can take years. Abuse survivors have an extremely complex relationship with their abusers, and I think simplifying it to the MC cheating due to trauma is unfair and a disservice to the writer who seems to be trying to portray a somewhat more realistic depiction of an abuse survivor. If you’re confused, I recommend doing a bit of research on this, if it is not too upsetting. I can’t explain it as well as a professional.
Of course, yes, it’s fiction, but I think regardless it is disturbing to see people in the comments espouse harmful rhetoric, hence I hope it does not translate to their real lives. People do really talk like this about real life survivors, after all.
I mostly agree with you, don’t worry, I’m not taking issue with your opinion necessarily.
Having any sort of relationship with a survivor who is still stuck like this is traumatizing and difficult.
While I’m not blaming the ML for being cheated on or being upset about it, or even for making mistakes, I want to just flatly acknowledge that jumping into a romantic and sexual relationship with someone who just broke away with their abuser is generally a bad idea.
It’s not fair to either of them, and MC still has a lot of mindsets and trauma responses to undo - years of abuse take a long time to undo. Not that he has to be completely free, but people breaking up with any partner tend to make bad relationship decisions after they break up.
MC needs a somewhat stable life on his own outside of his abuser before getting into a relationship. Again, while I’m not blaming the ML for getting cheated on, realistically he should not enter a relationship with MC until MC is stable, and he should have helped MC with that/avoided pursuing a relationship. It’s sad and traumatic for both of them.
I don’t remember if ML knew about MC’s history. He can’t help much if he doesn’t know, but he does realize and acknowledges that Woojin isn’t acting normal. He really needs to stabilize himself before getting into a relationship, he knows what he did was wrong, and ML should’ve expected this if he had known (I don’t remember though).
We weren't talking about cheating. We're talking about victims of abusive relationships and how the actually act irl. Victims aren't perfect, they make mistakes. The op was saying that people jn the comments are quick to judge the ml, just bc he cheated. The ML cheated bc he was anxious and turned back to what was familiar to him, it wasn't healthy, but it was what he knew and was an uncomfortable comfort zone.
Wait but was he being abused by the ex while he was dating the good bf? Cause I don’t remember if they kept in contact. It would make more sense had the ex kept contact with him and was putting all these ideas into his head to cause it. Were they still actively contacting each other? But I remember the mc started being distant from the ml and got really insecure and started thinking all sorts of ideas on his own then got in touch willingly with the ex. I don’t really get the part where he is still being abused while they were not in touch? Unless you meant to word it in a way that meant the mc was still affected by the abuse that caused it.
Btw I think you mean to say MC, not ML. MC means main character and we refer to the bottom as the mc. ML means male lead, which usually refers to the male love interest. We refer to the good bf as the ML. You might get people confused reading this comment thread by making them think the good bf cheated lol
The uke knew it was wrong from the start, he was not brainwashed to think cheating is wrong. He was cheated by the Minho dude himself and was hurt over it, yet he does the same. He knew it was wrong from the start, no excuses there.
That was not a “mistake”, that was intentional. But I do understand that he’s brainwashed to think Minho is alway right so he goes to him. Some things aren’t adding up but it’s okay so far realistically.
And it’s okay to judge the MC for cheating, he is a bad partner for cheating but I can’t hate him because it’s not like he WANTED to cheat. But he is bad for lying even after realizing what he did was wrong. Even after Taehwan reassured him, he felt relieved he didn’t know. It’s not good at all.
Woojin really needs therapy and distance from that trash before being in a relationship and hurting someone else. My trauma doesn’t give me the justification to hurt someone else who did absolutely nothing. I have to fix my issues first but I know it’s not always easy so I hope Woojin tells him afterTHAT situation happened in the raws (if you want me to spoil let me know).
No I don’t think they kept in contact.
you're so right
Thank you!! I thought I was about to get heat for saying that and was scared to open my notification lol. Thanks. I personally can’t hold a grudge on Woojin because he’s not those cheaters who wanted to. He did it because he was so anxious and just mentally not there in the head to think, but of course not justified to hurt others (taehwan). Sigh I hope they resolve this
YES!! Im sorry and thank you! Idk if I can edit replys here
It's not like he's brainwashed, how I interpret is that the MC got so anxious in his relationship with golden retriever boy that he ran towards the thing that would comfort him. That thing was Minho, not bc he was a good partner (we can all agree that he sucks), but it's bc something the MC knew very well, it was familiar, it was predictable. But after the crisis was over, he saw his mistake.
The MC is always miserable in love (ha! See what I did there!?) Bc he's seems to always be looking for a reason for people to leave him.
Cheating is wrong, I think we all agree in that. But that's not the point the op was trying to make. The reader isn't the one being cheated on, there's absolutely no reason to get this heated over this. And there's a way more productive and interesting theme we can discuss in this BL like abusive relationships, why is it common for victims to go back to the abuser, anxiety and fear of abandonment...
I agree that the MC isn't brainwashed, but he just went back to Minho's house bc it was familiar and predictable, and he felt comfort jn that.
I didn't know the reply was posted on the next page, I thought my comment had been deleted, please ignore the second one haha
(￣∇￣")
Oh no I just brought the cheating part up because one of the reply said all readers blaming him are victim blamers, I didn’t know if that involved the cheating part or not so I brought it up and cleared up that not all of them hating Woojin for the cheating is victim blaming
I’ve been in Woojin’s situation before and have been cheated on as well, so I’m aware of how things can be. It’s difficult to manage when someone is taking advantage of you and I was so naive back then. No support at all.
I think the MC is a bit brainwashed to think that Minho is a safe haven for him. He said it himself, he thinks Minho is right about everything. It’s sad
I’m talking abt what literally just happened in the story. They got back in contact and the ex immediately went back to the abuse. like he was just abused in like the last chapters uploaded. And (spoiler) will continue to.
TY, I appreciate you (๑•ㅂ•)و✧
You said “he was actively being abused.” I’m only talking about the part where he cheated due to his trauma from the abuse and the effects it had on his mentality. You said he was actively being abused and it was not trauma. But that doesn’t make sense because the ex and mc weren’t contacting each other before he cheated. If there was no contact being made and the ex was not full on actively influencing him by contacting him- then how would the abuse be continuing when he hasn’t even seen him?
The timeline goes: mc was in an abusive relationship, then got out of it and got into a relationship with the good guy. But the trauma from the previous relationship caused him to have growing insecurities which eventually led to him reaching out to the ex again. I still don’t see how what I said was incorrect.
I also was never talking about what happened after the cheating. The trauma topic I was discussing was only ever about BEFORE the cheating and how it caused the mc to cheat. You replied to me saying it was not past tense. But by definition of the timeline, it is. You also said I simplified it to the mc doing it out of trauma but regardless- that is part of the reason even if you don’t like how it’s simplified. Otherwise you’re implying that the mc didn’t cheat due to the trauma caused by his past relationship, and he did it cause he wanted to??
Anyways at the end of the day, this is all a fictional story and it is not as serious as you make it to be. Let us not mix reality and fiction and keep them both separate. Not every fictional story and relationship is as complex as you think because real life relationships are completely different. You can take real life abuse victims and stories seriously, but analyzing a fictional character based on real life logic is not the greatest idea. Some authors want to keep the characters more simple than complex like you think. And some authors give simple reasons for why the characters do things in contrast to real life people.
He reached out to his ex again, which is unfortunately the reality for abuse survivors, and his abuser immediately began abusing him again...? He is actively being abused right now in the story.
My original reply was never about what’s happening right now, that’s what I’ve been trying to tell you. It was only ever about before the cheating and how it led up to it. That’s it. But you tried correcting me despite not understanding what i talked about. He was NOT being actively abused before the cheating and was solely focused on his relationship with the good guy. I was only ever discussing why he started having insecurities and why he went to cheat. Never said anything about going back to the ex. That was never the topic or point I was trying to make
Okay, so let's simplify this then. He went back to his previous home after getting into a fight with ML - unfortunately this tracks, he feels like he does not belong there anymore and where else would he go? He genuinely does not have a place he feels like he can go to. When his ex wakes him up he immediately starts abusing MC.
He did not cheat until after he got back into contact with MC and started being abused by him.
It's years of trauma + the abuse he experiences the second he gets back into contact with his ex. Then the cheating happens.
Okay, but this is a story that has spent its entire time trying to realistically depict the mental trauma and anguish of someone who has in a long abusive relationship that has damaged their ability to make relationships. It goes out of its way to explore and establish less commonly known impacts of abusive relationships like this. The author is very clearly trying to portray abuse realistically.
Fiction's relationship with how it effects people in reality is complex, it shouldn't be simplified to, "Well, they're completely separate." People's opinions or views are often informed by fiction. My point is that I find it extremely concerning when people echo real life sentiments that harm abuse survivors towards characters with no thought, especially characters that are written more realistically. Many people, for example, will recognize traits or experiences in characters as in themselves. If someone goes through all of this and relates to the MC, how would they feel going to the comments and seeing people talk about how horrible they are? I've seen comments like the ones we're talking about on stories even where a character's biggest crime is being indecisive/not trusting enough/being scared. People arguing that blatant depictions of rape are Not Rape, Actually. Or that abuse is okay and forgivable if the abuser is also a survivor, and actually the survivor is at fault for leaving their abuser. It is not like this is the single story where this is an issue, it's a theme. As a queer man, SA survivor, and someone who has been through very abusive friendships, I find it concerning. Especially when I've faced people on this site who treat me like that.
Anyways. Ignoring semantical arguments. The point of my initial comment is: Hey, when you see stories with realistic depictions of abuse, it can be more than a little concerning when people say the same bad shit abt fictional characters that ppl say IRL to real survivors. So I genuinely hope people don't do that. It's upsetting and triggering. It's a theme on this site and genuinely every website I've ever been on and it concerns me. Obviously, I have no real control over people's thoughts and actions, but the fact that it's generally a sea of people who say this kinda stuff makes me feel like I should leave a comment acknowledging that hey, maybe that is not okay! Hopefully make some people feel better if they were upset or hurt. Y'know, the small things. Because I know I've been there, and seeing just one person say something is enough to give ease.
At this point, the story hurts me too much to continue reading it until we have a definitive ending, so I guess I'll see you all again when the story concludes.
To make it clear, I am muting now, as I cannot talk more abt a topic like this that is relatively triggering to me. Take care. (๑•ㅂ•)و✧
Hey you did great explaining, thank you. You took your dear time so others could understand! :) Cheating is never okay obviously. And what you said makes sense, great details. You paid attention to the story!
Thanks
And it’s more better coming from a queer man. I’m man myself (bisexual) and I’ve been abused as well so it’s great hearing your explanation on the effects of the abuse on victims. I’m kinda icky about the cheating situation but conflicted cause it’s not like he WANTED to cheat.
Exactly.
hey so the mute button didn’t work but ! ty for replies, i apologize if i ended up getting too emotional or anything! i was traveling all yesterday so i was pretty mentally wiped
ok ignoring the cliffhanger im SO HAPPY about the character arc that's happening rn. like taeju has been making so much progress but he has to accept that euihyun might not want him due to everything he's done before he can actually have any semblance of a normal, healthy relationship w/ euihyun. like he's gotta accept that euihyun is his own person who might want his own life. very happy, this is literally the exact character growth i was hoping for, i just hope that the cliffhanger stuff doesn't overshadow/prevent that.