Sweetie, I get your point and I completely understand.
But calm down, it's fiction...
(￣∇￣")
Bruh calm your tits giving us a whole ass lecture
Why post replies like this instead of discussing/defending some of the plot elements? I'm not going to stop posting opinions on stuff that irks me just because some people think I'm overreacting. I feel its worth being critical of the things we read. I personally use comments sometimes to decide whether to even bother reading something with a middling rating, so there are uses to lengthy breakdowns like this. Sorry if you liked the story and are upset that I complained about it; it really wasn't that good, and it's worth discussing where it went wrong.
No, no don't get me(us?) wrong, I(we?)
Completely. Understand. But sadly, there will be people replying to you with worse comments than ours in general. No jokes involved. There have been numerous people here that I can't point out that had similar valid reasons such as yours.. Well.. Ranted. Or, in your case, discussed. And those same people got downvoted the hell out.
I completely agree with most of your strong and/or weaker points about this manga, but you're going to have to remember something about us people on the internet;
"opinions don't matter, and no one gives a damn about what you said. If I liked it, then fuck off."
Not fair, is it? But, wait, what does that have to do with you? Your speech? Well, there may be an explanation to that. See, you're saying something that most people won't like, some that won't even bother reading,or some that may agree. That's what an opinion is, right? But wait, you also see that people who "love" the story getting full on discussions and such. And yet, what do you get? Negative comments? Comments that doesn't agree with your discussion, or in this case, your opinion? Well, this is indeed a somewhat popular story on this site, and when you shit on most people's favorite thing, what do they do? They bite back. Full force or just hard. If you were in love or was interesting in something, and you see someone taking all the bad parts out of them and naming them off, wouldn't you get upset? Say your favorite band, food, movie and/or person. But in this case, you wouldn't even "say anything", right? But you still disagree with them. That's how it works, you don't like something, everyone else will. And chances are, those people, even if a few, will jump you.
The story was blah, but it was cute. Definitely not a reread, but it was still enjoyable to some, unenjoyable to most. You may have not liked it, some maybe did, but who honestly cares? You gave us a reason why it was shitty, and other people gave us a reason why it was THE shit. But the point is, is it really all that serious? Criticism is great, and so are opinions, but what exactly were you expecting from a YAOI manga?
Sure, there are some out there that are legitimately awesome and wholesome, but not everything's going to turn out how you wanted it to! Not everyone is goin' to agree with you! Yes, even if this story was absolutely bland!
"Why post replies like this instead of discussing/defending elements"? Really? What were you expecting? This isn't reddit.
Not everyone is going to always agree with you, especially on an illegal website that translates/updates illegally. Moreover a website filled with possibly 15- year olds.
And no, it isn't wrong with what you're doing. You're not over reacting! And fuck those you apparently ticked off!
And again, I agree, that's what a comment section is for! To post your thoughts, give a thumbs up, thumbs down and/or criticism! But like I said,this isn't Reddit, this isn't wattpad, Pinterest or YouTube.
This is a website that updates STUPID manga, gay porn, etc, etc. And most times ILLEGALLY! Almost every yaoi on this site have a seme like this if not worse. Chances are, you'll even find some with a good, realistic, selfless and warmhearted guy! (I can actually recommend you some, one being "I'm home, welcome back"! All time favorite)
However, what I'm trying to say, is what you're doing is completely okay and harmless, but always expect backlash, okay? Rather a joke or not, not everyone is going to agree with you, and you need to accept that. No need to defend yourself, just say, "Whatever pleases you," and continue your day. Don't go back and forth with that person, me concluded. Nonetheless,
If someone complained on a pornhub video and said "it's bland, not realistic" you will always find a comment that agree, and a comment that disagrees. But again, what you're doing is completely find and normal! Not everything is perfect though
Fine* I'm an example
But wait, there's more
Wait, no, nvm there's nothing else.
This is supposed to be a light-hearted rom-com, but the story struggles right out of the gate before dropping a doozy midway through that tanks it completely. It's unfortunate, because the author is very good at writing comedic moments, and characterizing interesting side-characters, but seems to struggle with holding a long-form plot together. Noboru's brothers in particular are stand-out positives in an otherwise mediocre property.
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Note: I did finish the entire story.
First off, BL stories are usually written with one of two setups: "childhood friends" or "strangers' chance meeting". This story is setup like a childhood friends story, but is actually a strangers story, and so these two things don't quite line up right.
Basically Noboru and Naoya didn't know each other before HS, yet Naoya decides immediately that he has a crush on Noboru for no reason at all. He starts pursuing Noboru relentlessly, leaving Noboru confused and flailing because he's like "who is this guy and what the heck, man". Note that even by the end of the story this initial attraction is never properly explained. It skips past all the push and pull of such a setup, which is usually the most interesting part to read of this type of story. I will concede that the story does eventually explain why Naoya likes Noboru after he gets to know him better, because Noboru doesn't care about Naoya's family status, but this isn't something Naoya knows about when they first meet, and he doesn't even really know until many chapters later.
The next major problem is that the author can't figure out for several chapters how she wants to characterize Naoya, so instead we get a sequence of events of him behaving in completely different ways from the previous scene, for scene after scene, so the reader (and Noboru as well) can't be sure what sort of person he is. Anything he says could be a lie or an act, because we have no preestablished consistent expectation for his behavior. So Noboru is completely legitimate in not trusting him and/or expecting him to be full of BS, or to be teasing/playing with his feelings.
The next part is a personal preference, but Kazushi is an annoying character used in a cliche way in the first section of the story. Meanwhile, after he acts like a jerk, ruining things for both Noboru and Naoya, the story never really bothers to redeem him, yet the two leads keep allowing him to be around them to ruin more things. I can't tell if this was supposed to be some kind of comedic setup to be played over and over, but it falls flat because some of the things he does are really, really crappy, which doesn't fit for a character typically used in this manner (comic relief). Also, why didn't they call the police when he absconded with the twins? He literally committed a crime.
Also, another personal preference, but Naoya is a horribly generic seme/protagonist, and he isn't really that interesting to read about because you can practically predict everything he's going to say or do in a given situation. Name a hobby of his. Something he likes besides the uke. A personal tick or quirk that only he does? A subject in school that he's good at or a class that he likes? A sport he plays? Compare this to another one of the author's works, "Dekiai Itokon", the seme in that one is so chock full of personality that he's the best thing to read about in the entire story. (Also, the uke is less-interesting in that story and acts like a girl stand-in, so pair up Touji (seme) with Noboru (uke) and you have a much better story between the two of them, LOL)
Anyway, a side effect of the boring and predictable seme is that the story about Noboru/Naoya gets draggy and boring in the middle/end, making it difficult to finish. By the third volume you're begging for a side story about Ayumu, or some kind of redemption story about Kazushi, or maybe a Hiroya (older bro) story just to spice things up. Just something else that is more interesting than the Naoya/Noboru relationship which has been tiresome for a while.
And lastly, of course, the elephant in the room. In every story I've read with the rape-to-love and stockholm-syndrome trope, there will be people in the comments screaming that the seme is trash, and others trying to explain it away as justifiable. I shall submit one of my typical lists of points to be made about this subject in general, and also this subject as handled in this story specifically.
- Let's start off with a minor point. This sex scene was burdened with the cliche "teleport to a bed somewhere" trope that plagues so many BL stories, immediately disorienting the reader as they try to figure out the context of the situation. Were they in a hotel? Did they go all the way back to Naoya's house? Surely they weren't in Noboru's tiny house with all his brothers around?! I was like "what the heck is even happening" while reading the beginning of this scene, which served to make subsequent actions in the scene much more grotesque because the reader is already in a state of disorientation before the rape-y part even begins.
- Now, for the biggest point (and longest). Rape is a justifiable plot element in a story written appropriately around it (Kokoro o Korosu Houhou), but it is never, ever, a justifiable character action for a character played straight, towards someone they supposedly love, with no redemption arc to bring them back into the sphere of "good people". It doesn't matter if Noboru has some wrong idea about Naoya. It doesn't matter if Noboru yelled at Naoya, or if they got into a fight where Noboru was clearly wrong. It doesn't matter if Noboru was being a cocktease, being cute while not letting Naoya tap that azz. It is Noboru's body, and what he says goes, and any action taken by an outsider to violate Noboru bodily is a crime. Blaming Noboru for this is victim-blaming. "Oh she dresses like a slut so she wanted it" or "she was drunk, so clearly she didn't care if someone did that to her". This is not a good look to wear. Because Naoya is a seme played straight, this scene does not fit with the "good person" image the manga tries so hard to convey for him both before and after.
Also keep in mind that Naoya pushed his way into Noboru's life at the beginning of the story completely against Noboru's will, and insisted on continuing to invade Noboru's personal space over and over until Noboru effectively gave up on his pursuit of girls and allowed Naoya to have his way. This might be an acceptable sequence of events when the pushy seme is a rich, smart, talented sexpot, but if he was a balding, overweight, middle aged man, would people still think this was acceptable? I find, when viewed in this way, there is even less justification for Naoya raping Noboru because having a relationship with Naoya was never Noboru's choice to begin with, and of course he's going to be hesitant about going that far over to the "other team" until he settles it internally on his own.
I know this bullet point is already too long, but this is the last addendum to it -- I also find the story's explaining-away of Noboru's straightness to be suspect. He clearly liked girls from the beginning. Then Naoya's like, "you just appreciate their aesthetic in a non-sexual way, just believe me, I have no ulterior motives", and Noboru's like, "okaaaay" and just accepts this weird explanation like, what? This needs to be a decision Noboru comes to completely on his own, not something Naoya shoves onto him just to get his way. Otherwise the story turns into schlock that doesn't even bother trying to make sense anymore.
- Not only do we NOT get a redemption arc for Naoya after he does this hideous thing, but Noboru immediately forgives Naoya and then subsequently blames himself for the whole thing BEFORE Naoya even has a chance to apologize. Ugh. Why, manga, why? Again, I reiterate: Noboru did nothing wrong, and none of this is his fault, and Naoya is completely to blame yet never has to reap any consequences for his actions because he's already been forgiven before he has a chance to even think about what he did.
- This rape scene in general is inappropriate for the tone of the story. Light-hearted rom-coms don't have ugly rape scenes. This isn't Perfect Blue. This tonal dissonance is why this was such a jarring plot development for most people to read.
- The purpose of the rape is intended to convey to Noboru that Naoya is no saint, but instead makes Naoya look like a terrible arsehole, which is not the same thing, and is also incredibly detrimental to the overall story. People want to see the protagonist (Noboru) with someone they like who is portrayed as a good person because this is a rom-com not a psychological thriller. This plot development takes it in the opposite direction and turns a bland character (Naoya) into a bad person, because now he's disrespectful of Noboru's personal space, bodily autonomy, and personal choices.
- This disagreement between Noboru and Naoya could've been handled in any number of different ways and been less offensive and inappropriate, while also being more interesting and not a detriment to Naoya's character. Have Naoya communicate his feelings with his big-boy words, for a start. Or, have Naoya pull back from being friends with and stop associating with Noboru. Have him start becoming friendly with someone else, leaving Noboru to try and figure out what's wrong, and then they get into a shouting match with tears and whatever when things boil over. Have Naoya whip his own dick out and jerk off in front of Noboru while moaning Noboru's name, but not touching him, leaving Noboru to decide how to react (note: this is a crime too, but it doesn't involve personal violation of Noboru's body, which makes it feel less sleezy). Heck this last one could reasonably be played for laughs, and since this is a rom-com, where characters talk about poop almost constantly, would've been a better addition to the story. But honestly, anything else than what we got would've been better, really.
tl;dr -- The story had lots of problems right from the start, between questionable characterization choices, a bad plot setup, and tired tropes that should be put to bed already. The rape scene in particular was inappropriate and damaging to the story as a whole and Naoya's character in a way that it and he never fully recovered from, it was simply ignored and forgotten as if it didn't happen. I know this author can do better because she has, so its just a disappointment. There are good moments here, especially anything to do with Noboru's brothers, but overall these side characters and the interesting lead, Noboru, is wasted here.
Dekiai Itokon is a better story by the same author.
http://www.mangago.zone/read-manga/dekiai_itokon/