Read my comment below before this one.

My response below titled "be patient while reading ch 4" explains my interpretation of the events as well as the MCs' intentions and emotions. This comment is in response to the replies people left that, they think, de-legitamizes my 1st comment. I don't agree with them and said why, hopefully this allows room for thought in everyone's heads, some people are literally just not open to the idea that it might not have been rape which makes no sense to me.

DUDE I DONT EVEN WANNA READ ALLA THIS. ITS OKAY JUST READ THE MANGA, NO ONE IS GOING TO JUDGE U, EVEN IM GOING TO KEEP READING THIS MANGA. IT WAS RAPE, AND IT WAS INTENDED TO BE RAPE. You don’t have to justify it I’m just amused at why you are defending this so Stubbornly. I would prefer scenes like this didn’t exist at all in BL but it’s common, and just be aware that this manga romanticized rape and move on with reading,
. That’s it. It doesn’t matter. (I mean it does but I’m obviously gunna get no where with this lol)

It wasn't at you specifically, it was at the general public, i said that at the beginning. If you don't want to talk then just say so, jesus. You're hurtful you know?

To me it seems as though you're using too much context. Even if Oono wanted the seme at some point that doesn't mean that he couldn't be raped by the seme. People get raped while in relationships frequently enough, even in marriages. Just because you consent at one point doesn't mean that you have given consent for all the next times. Also, I agree with the humansin; you're way too focused on this. You should move on after saying your piece rather than reposting everything you've already said.

Yeah, i never said "if you give consent you always give consent". The difference here is that in those instances the victim resisted/made it clear they don't want it and the abuser knowingly continued. Rather than rape, i'm arguing that this is a classic example of someone being talked into a sexual act and then swept along into sex. Any time you agree to a sexual act there is inherently the possibility of it progressing. Would you say talking someone into sex is rape? As far as me "moving along", i'm posting my thoughts on this comments section because i want to. It's hard for the passing person to see everything i had to say if it's not all in one comment.

I reposted for obvious reasons, by doing so i was able to condense and better word everything while making it look cleaner. With everything there in one comment people can see everything that was said without having to read EVERYTHING and with everything easily accessible it should stop people from asking the same questions/bringing up the same things.

honestly the dumbest argument I've ever heard. I could be fuckin head over heels for a guy but not want them to shove their dick inside of me because i 'love theM uWu.' Also oh ok yep def didn't show any resistance, him kicking him like that and pushing him away was just a joke 100% conveys how much he wanted to have sex i agree makes perfect sense absolutely flawless wowie

100% Agree with Born, Eclipse and thehumansin.
Wrogn your argument is invalid. Search up rape and it says plain as day you have to say something along the lines of "I want it" every single time you have sex otherwise it's rape. There are some case where you should make sure afterwards and the person either says they wanted it or not but you normally do hear a response to indicate they want it - indicating it's consensual - during.
No consent, no sex. It's just rape if either partner does not explicitly state that they agreed in some way. In this case Oono didn't agree at all, he was told that he was going to lose his friend but he didn't 'make the moves' on his partner or say something like 'why not' so he wasn't even talked into it he was just stripped and forced to have sex, even the position made it hard for Oono to resist as his movements where restrained (due to the position) but he did manage to kick Kureshima which causing the bruise. Plus Oono had no time to be able to formulate a response/ give consent anyway, it happened so quick and he basically went into shock, too scared to say anything. He even states at the end of the chapter that Kureshima scares him.
You're like a lawyer trying to justify why the perpetrators action weren't rape.
No consent, no sex. No reason justify rape.

I had said he didn't put up resistance till the kick, my point was why would Kureshima stop till then with no reason to think he should? When he had a reason he did.

I disagree. There is nothing implying consent has to be said aloud. I'd even argue that it's more common for people to just go right into sex than to ask consent first. Spontaneous consensual sex is a very common reality. If you disagree then thats fine, but no need for name calling. I already addressed the "he scares me" line, did you read what i had to say? I don't think you did, you're so set on this being rape that you didn't bother to read anything i said. So, Eclipse actually didn't say much, not sure what you mean by you "agree" with them, if you agree with thehumansin that's fine, but maybe you should read my rebuttles to what they had to say? I feel i addressed all their points pretty well. It came down to a difference in opinions between them and i and while they did get irritated, they were relatively open to discussion and even acknowledged when i had a point or when they understood what i was saying. Want to try the same?

Also, you're actually making the same misunderstanding that Eclipse was under. In those instances, those being rape within established relationships, the difference is that the victim makes it clear they don't want it and the abuser continues even knowing this. It's literally just not the same scenario.

(*disclaimer* i dont really hate the seme or stories like this, ive read plenty in the past and will continue to read them, i just r e a l l y dont agree with what's being said here lmao). I (tried to) read through the entire thread to see what points were being made. I read through the other threads too, just for more context. The only conclusion I can get from this is: wow, this sounds just like what a rapist might say. Like dude i'm sorry but, if he's literally screaming no (judging by that sfx in chapter 3, i'm pretty sure he's *screaming/shouting* no) then i'm pretty sure that's not consent. Not once did he say "oh yes please take me hnng~" or even just a simple "ok" or "yes". What your arguement sounds and looks like (based on the actual manga and these threads) is "he showed no resistance, said he loves the seme and there was heavy petting previously so he must be ok with sex". Are you reading what you're saying?? Doesnt that sound super rapey to you??? If someone shoved their dick in me and then used those points as an arguement i'd take them to court lmao like did it not occur to you that maybe, just MAYBE, like in a shit ton of other rape cases out there (in r e a l l i f e), the victim might've gone into a state of shock and been unable to rationally process the situation? Not everybody will attack their rapist or go to the police about it, that's why so many cases get out of hand and last much longer than they should. The victim is shocked and has no idea what to do, especially if they like the perp in the first place. Also lol "but did you read the end of the chapter? He clearly says he enjoyed it and loves the seme" ok but did you read the beginning where he literally said it was extremely painful and his ass is bleeding. Bleeding. The day after it all happened, he's still bleeding. Does that sound normal?? Consent is now "i'm ok with heavy petting but not sex- hey please take your penis out of me it hurts- dude i like you but this really hurts and i'm not ready for this p l e a s e im bleeding". Though, dont get me wrong, it's not like i'm saying YOU'RE a rapist, i'm just saying the shit you said sounded super rapey lmao. I'm also pretty sure other people feel the same way. It's not that we're completely missing the point of your arguement or just straight up ignoring it, it's just that it sounds really rapey and weird. I saw that you made some points along the lines of "before the kick, seme didnt have a reason to stop" and "spontaneous sex isnt uncommon". Dude, what? Even if it doesnt start out as rape (during the heavy petting parts, it wasnt rape. He was ok with it, i know that), if at some point someone decides they dont wanna fuck/be fucked but are forced to anyway, it's rape. Unless someone says or shows a clear sign that they want to be fucked, you probably shouldnt fuck them. If you decide to fuck them anyway and they show even the slightest bit of resistance, then it's rape. I dont know if you saw the chapters in a different way or something, but during the sex scene, all i saw was a crying kid that doesnt want to be in this situation. Even if after it all, days later, he says that he enjoyed it, at the time it was clearly rape. Even if he was blushing and the "no" was in sfx, he clearly wasnt ok with what was happening. You can visibly tell the difference between blushing and saying no to sex that was consented with, and the same to rape. To me, all i saw was rape. I'm not "forcing" it to be rape, its just an observation me and quite a few other people have made. This became way longer than intended lmao. Pls keep this in mind lol k rant over ٩(•ᵕ•๑)ᵒᵏᵎᵎᵎᵎ

Firstly, I mentioned you normally figure out/ hear during sex whether it's consensual but it's still better and legally yes there has to be some sort of spoken consent or spoken resist like saying 'no'. It's easy to get consent anyways as it's easy to say I want it. I know what spontaneous consensual sex is and of course both parties would know they're into it by one another actions and verbal responses like 'oh yeah baby', 'harder' and 'feels so good' yaknow those kind of phrases used during sex to show that you actually like it and even doing something on the other person shows your consent to it like moving in to give someone a blowjob, if you push away or say no then no blowjob. However Oono despite saying he liked the sex in chapter 4 at the end after coming to his resolution that he might like Kureshima, we never got a clear definition of him actually wanting to have sex. Kureshima just pushed himself onto Oono and got him into a sex position which isn't exactly the easiest to resist especially when your areas are being stimulated.
Secondly, there was no name calling, I think it's rather childish you thought me saying you sound like a lawyer was offensive (as you've refered to it as name calling). Clearly I haven't read all your comments at first as I believe it's rape, I was blind sighted by how you haven't even looked at it as it being rape, it just felt like you where trying to defend the actions of a guy because he pushed himself onto Oono.
I have since read them all and I do still disagree with the he scares me comment, yes he tells you why - he doesn't understand him and his actions but the he scares me still means that Kureshima as a person scares him because of what he can't understand about him.
Thirdly, the feeling consent... If you say you didn't want it in court the re-butle of 'did you say no or try to stop it' doesn't work because as I said above he could've been in shock and over come with pleasure and actually it's not always wanted pleasure. It's like if you're drunk one scenario could be another drunk person rubbing on your crotch area but you're drunk, it feels good but you don't really know what to do so most often people just 'go with the flow' but they where intoxicated, both of them so how can we prove they wanted to do those things together? (drunkness being used as a likeness to feeling pleasured) Another scenario could be two drunk people dancing and one of them decides to start grinding up against the other one, what would we class that?
Although if we look at the beginning of chapter 4 Oono is very upset with Kureshima and thinks 'Who am I fooling' 'My ass is sore and still bleeding' 'No matter how much it hurt, he didn't stop' and yes this is nit picking details but the page where it says this it also puts the sfx of 'chills' on the page prompting that it's not a pleasant memory.
Also throughout the chapter he's upset with Kureshima because he pretends like nothing happens and Oono only seems to be swayed when he realised he's alone again and then he becomes jealous of Kureshima being in a relationship and seeing him with the other girl at the end triggered him to realise he likes him
As said before by thehumansin this manga seems to romanticise rape as Oono seems to only realise he liked Kureshima after them having sex that was too rough and unsolicited. (baring in mind I'm saying it is rape romanticising but read the rest of the paragraph) and in a lot of rape manga the victim doesn't want it to happen (especially if they do have some lingering feelings, they don't want it to happen that way/be to aggressive and lacking intimate) hence why Oono even thinks further in the chapter 'how dare this guy' 'after what he did' in the context of Kureshima asking Oono if he tried fantasied about Sasaki and asking him to tell him. Along with him being upset that Kureshima asking him about if he's trying to fantasise about another girl after them having sex (Kureshima pretending they didn't have sex still) he's still upset that he did it like that with the phrases 'how dare this guy' and 'after what he did' where used instead of 'how could he say that' and 'after we just did that'. Oono even says he's blaming Kureshima a lot during the chapter.
Going back to the in a lot of rape manga, the victim liking the perpetrator often gives the perpetrator a 'pass' because they convince themselves it wasn't actually rape when they didn't want it at the time. They convince themselves because they love the person and that the person didn't do anything wrong because 'I love him so even though I didn't say I wanted it then I love him so it's okay'. Hopefully this manga doesn't turn out like that and if this manga is indeed intended to be a rape romanticising manga I a least hope Kureshima gets some sort of reprimand for his actions and Oono doesn't just throw himself at Kureshima but makes Kureshima be more patient because Kureshima seemed to be completely swept up in the moment as to let the person he likes bleed during sex (yes I know this can happen a lot but he didn't prepare Oono adequately/ he made sure Oono's asshole was wide enough for his cock, we didn't see him stop or try to be considerate of Oono/ ask him if he's okay at all throughout the sex scene, we didn't even see if Kureshima did any after care which seems to be unlikely too since Oono mentions it's still bleeding instead of saying it's not as bad as before)
Overall, the manga seems to be portraying that it was a rape scene but they're just brushing off the severity and romanticising it, which isn't the best but it is what it is.
I acknowledge your opinion and believe that you believe that this isn't 'rape' but obviously my opinion and several others on this topic and the one before believe it's rape.
The only way to know if it was rape or not completely would be by the mangaka saying whether it was meant to be a rape scene, which we'll probably find out in the next chapter or it'll be left a mystery/ open to interpretation.

I'll respond going down your response:

"If he's screaming no, judging by that SFX, then i'm pretty sure that's rape."- That's the thing though, SFX isn't dialogue, it's a sound effect that the translator puts there. In ch 3, pg 30 another SFX used is "schlop, schlop", Kureshima isn't literally saying "schlop, schlop" here, it's a random noise that the translator thought goes best there. I think the same happened here, the translator saw the scenes and thought they looked like rape and decided to throw in a rape warning and add "noooo!" there to push their interpretation home. To make it seem more rapey. If you look at Oono's facial expression there, it doesn't look like a scream, it looks like a moan. I feel a more proper, less rapey SFX to put there would've been "ahh!~".

I'm replying to a big portion here: "-starting with- Not once did he say "oh, yes~ please take me~ or even just a single yes or ok. What your argument sounds and looks like is "he showed no resistance, said he loved the seme and there was heavy petting previously so he must've been okay with it... -ending with- To me, all i saw was rape. I'm not "forcing" it to be rape, it's just an observation me and quite a few others made."- Well, yeah? If we're talking about whether or not a character was feeling raped while having sex, then it makes sense to look at dialogue from his mouth about how he feels about the guy. It's not like he just forgot about the sex long enough to say everything at the end of ch 4, he said it all with the sex included in his mind, so logic dictates that he is saying this is how he felt DURING the sex as well, yes? You're placing a lot of what YOU THINK he was feeling on him, but he actually talks about how he was feeling himself. Not "days later" like you said, but DURING as well. You're ignoring that and saying he "said that in hindsight and that it isn't how he felt at the time", but he talks about how he felt AT THE TIME. You're just projecting whatever you want onto him. As far as you saying he "never said anything to indicate he wanted it like "oh yes" or "take me"", that's the thing, he didn't say ANYTHING, which is why it was so confusing how he was feeling during the sex, but if we're talking actual dialogue ABOUT the sex he DOES actually say a few things, albeit after. Like you mentioned, he says "his asshole is bleeding and sore and that Kureshima didn't stop no matter how much it hurt". If you take this at face value, out of context of the rest of ch 4 it does look like he's saying he didn't want the sex, but if you take in the rest of ch 4 where he expands on these thoughts he goes on to say "there's no way for us to go back to how we used to be and i cannot forgive him(goes on in a second to say he intended to blame him, denial), and yet what i truly want to happen-- this odd feeling (love), prickling me... It's-- NOT TRUE!-- Just now, what was i thinking? How unfair, i should be the only one (jealous of the new girlfriend, he the only one who should be touched by Kureshima, he says this while watching Kureshima touch her)... It can't be true. I pretended not to know. I intended to blame him, but deep down, i've always had delusions about him (literally saying here he intended to blame Kureshima for the sex). I didn't want to just watch (the delusions), i yearned to be touched again (literally saying he's always wanted to be touched by Kureshima). I was afraid that he'll see through me. Reality feels much better than delusions (literally saying here that the sex was better than he'd ever imagined it to be)". It looks obvious to me that he was actually feeling accepting even DURING the sex, he literally says so, he just shut that all down after and went into denial and intended to blame it all on Kureshima after he kicked him off. I actually took in all of the dialogue, not just the end, i addressed the beginning part as well. When he 1st starts speaking and says "who am i kidding? How could i be okay? My asshole is bleeding and sore. He didn't stop no matter how much it hurt", it sounded at first like he was saying he hadn't wanted the sex, but as the chapter went on it became clear that what he was upset about is that he doesn't know how Kureshima feels about him, he says "i don't understand Kureshima, he scares me", he is literally saying here that he doesn't understand Kureshima's intentions and he says it scares him most likely because he doesn't want to be played around with. When Kureshima comes in an treats him normally like nothing happened and then even gets a girlfriend later it sends Kureshima into a rage rather than the listlessness he'd been in that Sasaki was trying to talk to him through at the beginning. This is because what he was really upset about wasn't the sex, as evidenced by the end of ch 4, it was that he doesn't understand Kureshima's feelings and when he acts like nothing happened it looks to Oono like Kureshima was just messing with him after all. He literally says this as well, when Kureshima comes over and he yells at him, "so you were just messing with me!", before Kureshima gets angry and tells him "you know why (Kureshima fucked him). The opening dialogue on ch 4 wasn't him saying he didn't want the sex, it was exactly what it says, he is lying to Sasaki about being okay, because he is physically in pain. That's it. No need to connect that to how Oono was feeling during the sex, he's commenting on the present. He's acknowledging that he is actually in pain. Not sure how much you know about anal, but it actually IS very common to bleed during and after the 1st time, and to have bloody shits. you'll for sure be sore. He acknowledges that the sex hurt, as it would, AND he acknowledges that it felt better than he even imagined it would despite the pain. Again, he says Kureshima "didn't stop no matter how much it hurt", but Oono didn't convey that it DID hurt, Kureshima didn't know. Of course he didn't stop. Oono is just a little angry about that, that's it.

You're acknowledging that there was nothing said to indicate he wants it, as well as that there was nothing said to indicate that he DIDN'T want it after saying there has to be something indicating one way or the other and are still classifying it as rape. You just said both parties are responsible for conveying how they feel, that Oono wasn't conveying how he feels and then you go on to say it seems like rape anyways because Kureshima was pushy... Are you saying talking someone into sex is rape? Your statements contradict each other. As far as the lawyer thing, you used it in a derogatory way, you were saying i seem like one of those corrupt lawyers that tries to defend ACTUAL rapists, the ones that were actually givin resistance and verbal rejections and continued anyways. So maybe name calling isn't the right phrasing, insults sounds more accurate. Not sure how I'M childish for getting offended at a clear intentional insult. Victim blaming is a powerful thing.

This is kinda irrelevant, but since you used it as part of your argument... I guess it is. As someone who translates, when an 'sfx' says 'no', it usually means 'no', It's not strictly part of the dialogue, but still, translators don't just come up with words without basis. 'No' is a simple word, why the fuck do translators need to have some kind interpretation for that?

How would that be irrelevant? Whether or not Oono literally screamed no while being penetrated doesn't seem irrelevant. I'd say it's key. You say translators don't comr up with words without basis, but from personal experience i've seen the opposite in group chats posted as pictures in the mangas. It seems to be pretty free in choice. The translators CHOSE to put "schlop, schlop" instead of "splish, splish" or "schlorp, schlorp", etc. If the translators thought it was rape and were wanting to put a rapey SFX there it's GOING to affect how the readers perceive the scene as well. As far as it "being a word", i don't know if there even WAS text there that they translated into "nooo!", do you? I had said a suitable SFX to put there would've been "ahh" as Oono's mouth doesn't even look like he's screaming. Would've been a lot less rapey, more neutral.

Yeah, the text in that SFX isn't even "no"... Look it up. I checked chinese, japanese and korean lettering for "no" and none of the characters looked like what is inside the SFX bubble.

Gosh, you talk a lot. And I was actually referring to my comment as irrelevant...
But what I wanted to say was... translators put 'no' because it LITERALLY says no. It's kinda different from "schlop, schlop" which are actual SFX. You don't really have a definite translation for that, so I agree with you that translators would just come up with something. On the other hand, 'no' is a word, which would have a direct translation from JP to ENG. Also, considering that this is JP... Oono's mouth is just right, because 'iya' would mean 'no'.

I checked the japanese lettering as well, i said that just now, it doesn't say no. Feel free and check as well. Not sure why you're commenting on me talking, of course i'm responding to you. If you want you don't have to continue talking if i'm pissing you off, just say so. I can agree to disagree. I don't consider your comment "irrelevent", talking between 2 people is never irrelevant.