Just Making My Point More Clear

You're not a bad person, besides I'm more concerned if people really do think it's okay to sleep around in order to advance in the world.

No and it is perfectly okay to post about it contrary to what others would have you believe.

wist-ful you need to read the comments down below lol their are tons of people commending the uke for sleeping his way to the top

in my opinion if you want to sleep around its your body & nobody should dictate what you do with it.
but don't try to package it in a way that makes it looks like the person is a hero or what he is doing is some how commendable, that's ridiculous, there is so many other ways to advance in society.

Most definitely your opinion based on your conservative values does not necessarily make you a bad person; however, an argument could be made that your statement is specious and self-serving (whether consciously or subconsciously), because it implies that those that empathize with Karasuma “approve” of people sleeping around for money and power, when that is incorrect. That type of misleading argument is what the field of logic calls a “misleading fallacy” or a “fallacy out of context” where select script or words are chosen, excluding the original context in order to distort the person’s original point or meaning.

And the reason for this is because I have not read any person in this forum regarding this topic that has stated promiscuity for its sole sake is a good thing or that has condoned sleeping around to advance one’s career as a positive or acceptable behavior. What I have found instead are readers that empathize with Karasuma’s individual circumstances within the context of the fictional world of the Omegaverse and commend Karasuma for refusing to allow himself to be victimized by the subjugating social mores of his discriminating society, even if the path he chose was a very painful and self-destructive one. To commend Karasuma for taking charge of his own destiny does not equate people celebrating promiscuity or condoning sleeping one’s way up the corporate ladder; again, that is just a gross misinterpretation of the real and full context of people’s defense of Karasuma.

Regarding your ease of use of the derogatory slur “slut” (irrespective that it’s used here to address a fictional male character), an inference could be made on your potential (internalized) misogyny. Again, being conservative and apparently misogynistic does not make you a bad person, but most probably potentially closed-minded and apathetic; but that is just my very limited conjecture based on your statements in this thread, since in reality you could be the most empathetic and open-minded individual for all I know, is just that it doesn’t transmit here.

i loved this manga i think it was brilliant, it opened up a conversation about morality and societal strata (you know what i'm gonna change my first statement to that)

1.) having a difference in opinions does not make you close minded
people who indulge in bestiality would look at us and say we're close minded hhm
and besides i clearly stated that its your body and your free to do what ever you want with it. its just that i don't believe having relationships like this are healthy for someone emotionally and physically.

and so was the message i got from this manga which is being in toxic relationships like that would only lead to pain and heart beak in the long run
and MC definitely showed that

hence what i feel towards these people is not apathetic its pure pity

you said Conservative and misogynistic
i'm guesting your american and a feminist

we from two different worlds...

2.) here in Jamaica, our culture dictates that its shameful for someone to engage in these acts both MALE and FEMALE so its not misogynistic if the rules applied to both parties
also the words slut and cunt etc etc isn't necessarily a derogatory slur here (like the word nigger) they definitely have a negative connotation tho...
in Jamaica there are a list of words that will land you jail time if used in public (so much for freedom of speech) and slut isn't one of them but i apologize if i offend anyone and i'll remove that from my previous statement as well.
but by giving it such a status aren't you are only giving the word more power just curious...

in essence you have your beliefs i have mine please don't insult my culture because it contradicts your belief.

Hi, V-chan,
Thank you for willing to engage and taking the time to address my post. I definitely do agree that having a difference of opinion does not make anyone close-minded; however, it is the basis or the foundation of the opinion that makes a person potentially close-minded or not. Again, I’m not implying that you are because there is no way I can fairly ascertain such a thing based on the limitations of a single thread on the internet; but typically, individuals with strong conservative values tend to be closed-minded as supported by empirical data from the social sciences (psychology, sociology, etc.); however, considering that you are part of a yaoi community which it’s inherently deviant, makes it unlikely you are a purely conservative individual. Regarding promiscuity, I feel confident that an overwhelming majority agrees with you that it is not a healthy nor desirable thing for anyone for the emotional and health implications it represents. That is a point that requires emphasis, almost nobody would ever consider promiscuity to be a positive thing, and nobody in this forum so far as I have read, has voiced approval or has condoned promiscuity, so in that respect we are all in agreement.

And yes, I concur that part of the underlying message of the manga in the specific case of Karasuma, to engage in sexual relationships without feelings is emotionally draining and self-destructive, because it is made clear that Karasuma hated what he was doing and himself for it; but, that may not be the case for another character in another manga, or some individuals in real life, as there are people that engage in casual sexual relationships without being emotionally damaged, who are very successful and emotionally stable and stop engaging in casual sex once they meet a partner they fully commit to. I may not agree with that viewpoint or lifestyle, but that doesn’t make them a better or worst person than me. Which begs the question of pity, because in order to feel pity for someone or something, one has to assume that person is suffering some sort of misfortune, which may not necessarily be the case for that individual. So, when we feel pity for someone we have to assess ourselves honestly, are we doing it truly out of compassion or out of a sense of superiority?

Regarding the subjects of misogynim and conservativism, I’m Latina born in Nicaragua, Central America, a Latin American country of ultra conservative values characterized by its institutionalized misogynism and misogynistic culture. The things that are found socially unacceptable in the United States and other industrialized countries, are par for the course in most Latin American countries like Nicaragua; so we actually share similar cultural backgrounds; however, just because something may not be considered objectionable by a given culture, does not mean that we should blindly accept it without question. The issue of misogyny, just like racism and homophobia, are universal problems that transcend cultural norms and barriers as it is a matter of human ethicality and justice. You don’t need to remove the word “slut” just because it offends others, what is imperative is that you understand the root, the history of the slur and how it has damaged and continues to damage the intrinsic value of women as human beings within misogynistic societies which you and I happened to been born in.

Ultimately my differing opinion stems from my understanding of misogyny and the damage it has historically caused and continues to cause not only in the female psyche, but in the overall intrinsic value of women, and how it is a universal problem that transcends cultures and continues to be perpetuated not only by men, but by women as well through the casual and arbitrary use of misogynistic slurs like “slut”, among other forms of misogynism; that nobody in this forum has expressed approval for Karasuma’s promiscuity, that in fact we all agree it was self-destructive for Karasuma, but that despite of it, we still found value in the choices he made because it was the weapon he used to assert himself; but at the same time acknowledging that some individuals are ok engaging in casual sex and that doesn’t make them better or worse than myself just because I don’t share that viewpoint. Ultimately, this is not a matter of different cultural values, this is about trying to be a conscientious human being.

hi, kyouran ヾ(❀╹◡╹)ﾉ~

1) I/my culture is not misogynistic if i hold man and women to the same standards

2) my culture also condemns homosexuality, but i'm a big advocate for equal rights at my school so i'm not blindly following traditions.

3) i didn't understand the concept of "conservative" so i googled it. SURPRISE! i'm not a conservative because i go against traditional values.

3) my sense of pity is definitely coming from a place of concern. see, i'm apart of the peer counseling committee at my school, and every individual I've encounter whether directly or indirectly have suffered because of promiscuity so i'm making my assumptions based on personal experience.

4) no i don't think i'm better or worse than people who engage in casual sex,psst that's nothing. i'm just concern about the people who have to get a different partner every night and engaging in gangbangs and such (●￣(ｴ)￣●)



ps i removed "slut" because i don't want to come off the slightest bit offensive that is just my principle