Yoonbum and Sangwoo's relationship isn't romantic.

I've read KS and will probably read the next chaps as well to only see how it ends.but i couldnt be agree more with you.. Its so twisted.. Sangwoo is a murderer..i hve no idea why people go all "awww" about sangwoo or when they see
At Bum terrified face.. Maannnnn.. I wonder what kind of reaction those people gve if Bum is a Woman?? Will they still "awwww" ing ??

I agree with everything except the part where you start calling people ''immature'' for shipping it for the sake of it. The fact that you took this WAY too seriously is already beyond me. The only reason i even like this manga is because: FINALLY something NOT the same old boring ass story.

ikr! and that's actually a good point, i hadn't thought of that before. i'm sure if bum was a woman no one would even read the manhwa. that just goes to show how twisted society's views on gay relationships are and how they're fetishized so much. it also shows society's views on males being abuse victims.

I agree tbh. No idea why people like this ship. It's going to become the next Joker and Harley. I just know it. ┑(￣Д ￣)┍

mm, i agree, it was probably immature of myself to start name-calling. thank you for pointing this out.

yeah. i was never into the joker/harley fandoms but i know my fair share about them.

Lol, caring about a dislike. People can have an opinion on whether they like your post or not. Normal people see the difference between what is a normal relationship in reality and a unhealthy relationship in fiction, but they can still like it because they know it is fiction and it just makes up for an interesting story. Not every fictional couple has to be super healthy, the dysfunction is what makes for an interesting dynamic and the reason why people enjoy it. That doesn't mean that they want it in real life.

Ya well because i really wonder about "what if its a straight pair?" For example.. This also couple from fantasy world..Also not real..There're people adoring And ship Joker/Harley despite Joker is such a psycopath And also kill/torturing people..but harley still love him and people Awwww ing n ship them..the diferent is i dont think Joker ever breaking harley Legs/slicing her/make her doing chores/make her terrified to death??
But what if Joker exactly did the same to harley what sangwoo did to Bum..will the ship still sailing?? Maybe.. Will they say Joker is Goal?? Or still romantizing them? Or will people go batshit bout joker is a woman abuser even if its just fantasy and not to make fun of it because it might happen in real live to a woman? hmm thats why im curious..

The joker has definitely thrown her out of a window before.

People can romanticize absolutely anything in fiction, or dinosaur erotica would not exist (see, e.g. https://www.amazon.com/Taken-T-Rex-Dinosaur-Erotica-Christie-ebook/dp/B00FI9JFFO). It's fine to point out that the relationship is unhealthy, and I understand not shipping it--but as long as the people who do ship it know the difference between fiction and real life, they can do what they want.

"Should" can be kind of problematic when applied to fantasy. At least, I think so. Let me ask this: What is the effect of people romanticizing abusive and twisted relationships if those attitudes never carry over to real life? I agree that in real life, such attitudes are harmful on many levels, but if it does stay as a fantasy, does it hurt anyone if I have naughty thoughts about a villain like Loki? (Sorry, The Joker's not my type.)

I know stories and popular media carry cultural attitudes that may effect us all--but the meaning we create from stories is rarely literal, and story elements (and fantasies) can have more than one function. I see value in discussing such topics, but once we cross from discussion and looking at real life effects (if there are any) into what people "should" think or feel, it seems kind of restrictive to me, and I think there is a danger of black and white thinking.

Ehehe Cmiiw..even so..she's still such a badass..

I completely agree with you

I agree. I honestly wouldn't even be able to read this if Bum was a woman. I take this comic very seriously and like the dialogue the author creates about mental health issues. I found it very interesting that the victim being a male changed how I experienced this comic. It is still terrifying, but so much less nerve wracking than it would be to read if it were of a woman. It takes me back to watching the movie The Call and how distraught people were in the theater. My stomach couldn't calm down and at some points I was like, idk how I can make it through the rest of this, I mean I was really full of adrenaline and wanting the victim to escape. The man next to me had his head in his hands and the woman with him was having to rub his back. I wonder how different watching movies like that would be if I were a man though and didn't have to face the reality of this is something I am in danger of.
In real life, you don't hear this happening to men. It happens overwhelmingly to women and isn't even rare. This story has really opened my eyes though to how it would definitely be easier for most men to feel a lot less pressure watching and hearing these real life stories than it is for women. What I like about this comic is that I don't have to feel sick seeing myself as the victim, because we aren't. When it is a woman, women naturally put themselves in that position, but with this comic a lot of that pressure is taken off of us.

Completely agree. But I think it has even more to say though. I think this comic honestly is amazing in the dialogues it is creating and how much it is making us all think about social and psychological issues.

I think it even goes much deeper into the roots of why bl content was even created. Women feel relief of not having to see ourselves as the victims when we read bl. We have the relief of not holding ourselves to standards the male in the comic would be held to if they were a woman. Its very interesting and an in depth analysis would probably say a lot about what has been and is still being done to women psychologically in our male dominated societies and ways of thinking. I mean, even in the ads just created in the 1940s you can see how we have barely evolved. Seriously, everybody look up ads from the 1940s. They encourage violence against wives to keep them in place. It is very scary and very real. We try to forget our history and believe it is behind us, but it still influences out societies and we are still trying to undo this damage. Bl is a good example of outlets women create to deal with the pressure they've felt. It isn't always healthy either, a lot of bl is not progressive and is very damaging to gay men as well as women.

I understand your position, but do you have any proof that there is damage coming from BL specifically, or is it merely that it may reflect some problematic elements in real life? Are you sure that you have established causation--or are you perhaps inferring more than the facts can support?

i mean, i understand f you ship it and ill realize that it's wrong (like ereri i suppose). idk. i feel like there are two sides of the argument and that both of them have their flaws and strengths. thank you for speaking your opinion though <3

Yes, the proof isn't even hard to find. Look up documentaries about living as a gay person in Japan if you want. I have seen videos and blog posts coming from gay men who felt uncomfortable with the way they were treated by women that read and like bl. They have had their pictures taken without permission and been asked invasive questions by women who like bl or have called themselves fujoshi and bl fans. Also from documentaries I've seen about being gay in Japan, a group of people went to look at many different things concerning gay relationships in Japan, like clubs and bars, and even discussed bl and fujoshi. They actually meet up with self proclaimed fujoshi and the way these straight women acted and their thoughts towards gay men were truly bothersome and messed up. They completely fetishied gay men and gay relationships. I've also read various websites trying to get more info on the lgbt communities in Japan because I have wanted to visit Japan and these things are important to me, and the general consensus of actual gay people is that the overwhelming majority of women that read bl do not treat real gay people properly.

Theres also the fact alone that the bl genre is created and caters to specifically to straight women as their demographic (though they are not the only people that read it, I know) and its historical roots and origins are tied heavily into men forcing themselves onto other men and lots of rape which you still find highly prevalent in the yaoi and bl genre.

Thanks for not being mad. :) I don't actually ship this particular couple. I just don't like blanket statements that condemn others for their fantasies. I think there should be no rules to fantasy, as long as people know the difference between fantasy and real life.

You have every right to discuss the aspects of the story you find disturbing. And to disagree with people's posts. It's just that I think people sometimes simplify the issue of how fiction influences people and may be quick to draw unwarranted assumptions.

yeah, no problem. i'm all for debating and seeing the other sides of each argument, haha. what concerns me is the people who are interpreting the abuse as romance and overlooking the psychological aspect of this manhwa. thanks for not being afraid to post. though.

thanks dude <3