Just a question

I mean,,, there’s an argument to be made that he doesn’t consent to everything that jaekyung does. The first time they had sex, he didn’t go over thinking that he would be having sex, so arguably he was coerced into it. Furthermore he certainly didn’t consent to rough sex and even though he repeatedly asked to stop, jaekyung didn’t and continues to not, so overall consent is almost constantly quite dubious at best and rape at worst. Not to mention, when jaekyung initially demanded to have sex in more public locations like the gym, again Dan didn’t want to have sex there which makes it, say it with me, non-consensual. Doesn’t matter what jaekyung paid for, he never explicitly stated that he would expect dan to have sex with him in semi public spaces, which to me at least, and likely to the law as well, crosses the line into rape.

Even if you initially consent to sex, consent is something that is able to be revoked at any point in time before or even during the act (safe words?? Hello????). Once that consent is revoked (which we can only assume is any time Dan says no or stop since they don’t have a safe word), anything thereafter could be considered rape. Furthermore, you can’t fully consent to something unless you are fully aware of what you are consenting to. In the beginning, though he may have eventually been coerced (which again, isn’t full consent) he certainly didn’t consent to rough sex with little to no prep, foreplay, or aftercare, this making the sex not fully consensual.

I just wanted to say that I liked the politeness of your attempt to explain. Unlike many people who often use harsh words and have no manners.

I just how the explained fit better to the story. To make that point they are disregarding many things.

Drlvi, It is people that don't understand the story or takes one line instead of the whole scene or story. Also, there are many hate readers that are changing the story to spread more hate. People forget that he is a shy SA survior virgin.
Let's look at Arandompersonidk's comments. They failed to mention that DAN LIED ABOUT HIS SEXUAL EXPERIENCE to Jaekyung. Dan had many chances to say he was virgin. Jaekyung told him there is no reason for him to go easy on him when Dan lied and Dan could had corrected that. Dan had over an hour to correct that to where Jaekyung would had went slow. Dan just said wait and let him wash up.
You can't consider something being rape on cherry-picking and taking things out of context to make it rape. Dan was fully aware of over an hour.
Dan could had changed it and he did not. He knew it was going to be rough. He did nothing to fix it when he time to fix it.
They failed to mention that Jaekyung told him to go home twice and Dan chose to there. He decided to bit the bullet. Jaekyung is not coercing him into sex. he made a threat then told him to go home. When Dan initially said no, Jaekyung was on the phone calling someone else.
Dan says wait then says to put it in. He tells jaekyung to put it in AFTER BEING PREP. DAN stopped it. That is not rape. If you read their comment it sounds like Jaekyung just pounced him but Jaekyung wanted Dan to prep himself and then he took over. Dan felt embarrassed and did not want to feel turn-on, told him to put it in.


At the end of chapter, Dan says Stop don't and forced into the pillow with an threat
but Dan will say you just startled me and no i can do it. They failed to say that Jaekyung was concern when Dan was crying that he checked on him. They failed to say that when Dan says no it is too deep that Jaekyung did stop.

non-consensual isn't just rape. it is a scope. Jinx is non-consensual but it is not rape. Sexual coercion is sexual assault not rape.
Consent is something that can be revoke but they failed to say Dan return the consent many times. Saying no or stop in sex .. is not rape because those no or stop could mean anything. We see Dan saying No to question. People say no or stop when the emotions are too much or when they are lost in the feelings. They don't know what they are saying and don't mean stop or No.
Yes No means NO but it is not all the no's. it is a certain NO. While Dan is saying no he is not saying that to no to Jaekyung especially giving Jaekyung consent lines right after.
He was being prepped and he stopped it.
So.. Arandompersonidk did not explain Jinx but their own version of Jinx to make it rape while not understanding rape, non-consensual or Sexual assault.
That is the problem here with people thinking it is rape because they get hang up on one line with out looking at the full story.
The condition is no matter the time or place Dan would spread his legs that does include the public places.
The law would not acknowledge that contract. But what happens in 7-8 is sexual coercion, not rape. IF you look in chapter 8 Dan seem to crave because he wanted too.
People are triggered by rape. They see red when they think it is rape but they don't listen to people or the story. Some of them took pleasure in attacking a rape survivor just to have rape in Jinx.

Hey! Ur definitely right in some regards, tbh I had forgotten the some of the exact details of the first time Jaekyung and Dan have sex. That said, I still stand by my argument. What prep there was wasn’t enough (there’s like one panel with what looks like blood coming from possible tearing). Also, while my argument about like revoking consent may not be as applicable to that first time they have sex, it is CERTAINLY applicable to times thereafter.

Furthermore, my point with Dan saying no was more so about how unclear things are when there aren’t things like safe words established. You are right, not all No’s are created equal, however in a relationship where there is no word to signal a hard stop in whatever is happening, what do people say when they don’t want something to happen? They say “no”, they say “stop”.

I stand by that legally speaking Dan has ground to stand on if he were to pursue SA charges against Jaekyung.

I think another disagreement comes from how we’re thinking of and defining rape versus coercion. I personally consider them to be similar in that both could result in the perpetrator being charged with sexual assault. Functionally, they are two different events, two different experiences. Rape is non consensual. Sexual coercion is dubiously consensual. I belong to the school of thought that unless both parties consent enthusiastically, intercourse shouldn’t happen, so from my perspective while sexual coercion isn’t necessarily on the same level of severity as rape, it is similarly severe.

I disagree with your claim that I made up my own version of Jinx. While I may have been fuzzy on some of the exact details many of my arguments still stand. You cannot in good faith tell me that in every single one of Dan and Jaekyung’s sexual encounters both parties consent enthusiastically. It’s objectively false. I could go further and argue that hiring a random PT for sex is different than hiring a prostitute for sex as one is just some guy and the other is a professional and with that comes professional knowledge about what paid sex entails. I could argue that it’s unreasonable to expect Dan to be a perfect victim and that him lying doesn’t really mean anything in regards to his consenting to that initial encounter. However, I won’t because this isn’t a college lecture, this is the comments section of a pirated webtoon.

Finally, you ignore why I made the initial reply in the first place. The commenter didn’t know why some people thought that Jinx contains rape, and so I replied giving them information as to why some people thought that it contains rape. I literally just answered OP’s question.

A few more thoughts on this reply, I never claimed to dislike Jinx, I am just providing analysis of its content. If you think that pointing out that there are a multitude of points of highly dubious consent automatically means that I am passing judgement upon the quality of the webtoon, I think that says more about your media literacy skills and personal biases than anything else. These kind of works live in shades of grey.

Denying that there is SA within the main pairing doesn’t mean that it isn’t there, and pointing out that it is there doesn’t mean that I’ve written off the people or the story. It’s okay to admit that their relationship isn’t healthy, that the sexual dynamics at the beginning of the relationship aren’t healthy. You can still enjoy the story while acknowledging these things. I would argue it’s even more so important to acknowledge these things if you are someone who enjoys the story, even if it doesn’t feel the greatest to do so. If you don’t, then YOU risk becoming the person who isn’t understanding/listening to the story and the people in it.

Also idk what ur talking about with people enjoying attacking actual SA victims then have SA in this story, maybe I missed something? More context is needed but I am having trouble connecting the dots between this and your initial argument.

Ty, I’m afraid I’ve dug myself into the trenches with this one haha (╥﹏╥) I generally just give everyone the benefit of the doubt, no need to be mean to someone who has shown zero signs of asking in bad faith

You dug yourself into the trenches? Did you really?


Let it be noted this is my first message to you (here). I did not ignore anything. The comment you are replying to is I answered the OP's question and it was addressed to the op "Drlvi,"

You see many on this page are hate readers that will take the story out of content or some have only read a summary provided by their friends. The ones that thinks it is rape are not the real target audience (for the most part). Yes, you may had gotten the details wrong. i will apologize if you were not making up your own version of Jinx. There was perp but that prep went to waste because Dan tighten up. Also, https://www.healthline.com/health/healthy-sex/my-boyfriend-ripped-me It is common. Dan has a small hole and Jaekyung is massive. I think Dan could had teared with anyone. Why? Because for one he is scared of sex being a SA survivor.

There is no rape in Jinx when you look at the story. You don't need safe words and even with BDSM. https://www.lascivity.co.uk/do-i-need-a-safeword-guide-to-safewords-in-bdsm/ There are preset words but some are ignored if they are playing consensual nonconsenting stuff. Yes, Dan is saying No, stop but he is giving the green light too. if you read chapter 40.. Jaekyung thinks he has been ACTING shy. Jaekyung is experience and thinks Dan is experience. How many bottoms have acted like Dan with him. Jaekyung is able to read some part of Dan that many here can't or won't

It does seem like you are cherry-picking the "noes" and "Stop" Look at the scene or the next line Dan says as my friends would say
.
"I stand by that legally speaking Dan has ground to stand on if he were to pursue SA charges against Jaekyung."
It will fail. From a friend, ". If you want to call it rape, you can’t call Joo a rapist because he is clueless. As a rape crisis counselor, it does come close to rape at times, but the next scene changes it. As a whole, what is there no but if we add thoughts… but then in the real world wouldn’t we all be trouble
- Yes, judge, I told him yes.
Yes, judge, I told him to put it in.
Yes, I said no but I told him to go gentle after.
However, I was thinking, I didn’t want this. I wanted it to be done. I wanted him to stop as I verbally gave him consent, even after I took it away. Then judge, I agree to a contract to have sex with him at anytime he wanted to. I am saying I am raped because I was thinking I didn’t want to.
The ones saying rape is harming real rape survivors. Joo is toxic but you see, he stopped when he was crying and did stop at one of the times Dan said stop in their first time. Joo wants sex not rape. Rape is about power and control. I wonder if the author will have it revealed Dan didn’t enjoy it and Dan lied to him the first night a few times. Joo isn’t going to happy. Joo thinks Dan had experience, but Dan was an inexperienced virgin.
With all the facts from the story, if you want to call it rape, that is your opinion. With all the facts, Joo is not a rapist. Go back and read it without reading Dan’s thoughts. Read it as if you are in the room or Joo. Pay attention to Joo, especially when Dan is crying."

He wrote that months ago.

You can disagree with how "we" define rape versus coercion. I was quoting websites. You are not disagree with me. But why are you adding opinions on me?

I said "non-consensual isn't just rape. it is a scope. Jinx is non-consensual but it is not rape. Sexual coercion is sexual assault not rape." i said non-consenual isn't just rape. It is a scope. That means rape is included in nonconsensual but so is many others
https://www.lawinsider.com/dictionary/nonconsensual
https://academicaffairs.syracuse.edu/faculty-affairs/policies-and-procedures/faculty-manual/4-2-sexual-activity-non-consensual/

". The University will not tolerate rape, sexual assault, or other forms of sexual violence or nonconsensual sexual activity."
Why is a university separating rape and nonconsensual? "Any actual or attempted nonconsensual sexual activity including, but not limited to: sexual intercourse, or sexual touching, committed without physical force, coercion, threat, or intimidation; exhibitionism or sexual language of a threatening nature by a person(s) known or unknown to the victim."
Sexual touching is non con? touching?

https://legalvoice.org/nonconsensual-pornography/
“Nonconsensual pornography” is when a sexually graphic image of you is shared without your consent.

https://www.youthpower.org/youthpower-issues/topics/non-consensual-sex
Non-consensual sex takes many forms, including forced sex, transactional sex, cross-generational sex, unwanted touch, and molestation.

Rape is non-con but not all non-con is rape but explain how molestation is rape?
Jinx is non-con but it is not rape.


Now explain how a sexually graphic image of you that is being shared without your consent is rape, since that is considered Non-consensual.

I clearly stated, Jinx is non-con but not rape. why are you saying I denying the SA when I also said "Sexual coercion is sexual assault not rape." Implying Jinx had sexual coercion. https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/sexual-coercion. ". It is a type of sexual assault because even if someone says yes, they are not giving their consent freely." Only one time on that page do they make clear one type is rape. The rest is sexual assault. Rape is also sexual assault. If you want to make this fictional story "Real" don't use dubiously that is only with fictions.
"You cannot in good faith tell me that in every single one of Dan and Jaekyung’s sexual encounters both parties consent enthusiastically. It’s objectively false." why are you saying this? Maybe if you look deeper at Dan you may understand.

Yes Dan lying amounted to many things. If Jaejyung he would not had rough sex. I already debunked that argument. The story debunks that arguing. That is the third or fourth time where your comments don't correlate.


"A few more thoughts on this reply, I never claimed to dislike Jinx, I am just providing analysis of its content. If you think that pointing out that there are a multitude of points of highly dubious consent automatically means that I am passing judgement upon the quality of the webtoon, I think that says more about your media literacy skills and personal biases than anything else. These kind of works live in shades of grey."
You are putting two topics together. IF you never said it then it was not about you and it was not about you. That says more about your literacy skills and personal biases.


Where did i deny there is SA within the main pairing? Saying there is no rape does not mean there is no SA. SA is too a scope. I am not denying anything. https://www.rainn.org/articles/sexual-assault

"What is sexual assault?
The term sexual assault refers to sexual contact or behavior that occurs without explicit consent of the victim. Some forms of sexual assault include:

Attempted rape
Fondling or unwanted sexual touching
Forcing a victim to perform sexual acts, such as oral sex or penetrating the perpetrator’s body
Penetration of the victim’s body, also known as rape
What is rape?
Rape is a form of sexual assault, but not all sexual assault is rape."



" It’s okay to admit that their relationship isn’t healthy, that the sexual dynamics at the beginning of the relationship aren’t healthy. " Why did you write this?

"You can still enjoy the story while acknowledging these things."
Why did you write this? I never said my view on Jinx and on this page you can enjoy this story while acknowledging the SA in this story.
My information comes from a rape crisis counselor.
I said a rape survivor. Not a SA survivor or victim. They are not victims. They are survivors. She was not molested. She was not founded. She was raped.
Maybe you are having trouble because there was no arguments. I answered two people with some facts from the story and real life facts. Sharing information is not an argument. And again, this is my first comment to you in this thread. I think ever because I don't recall you. I wasn't even attacking you. I only talked about the story. So why are you making up my opinions?

Some corrections. I proofread that so many times. Why it is after you post it, you see many mistakes?

*You see many on this page are hate readers that will take the story out of context or some have only read a summary provided by their friends. The ones that think it is rape are not the real target audience (for the most part). Yes, you may have gotten the details wrong. i will apologize if you were not making up your version of Jinx. There was prep but that prep went to waste because Dan tightened up.



*Yes Dan's lying amounted to many things. If Jaejyung knew he would not have rough sex. I already debunked that argument. The story debunks that argument. That is the third or fourth time where your comments don't correlate.

This is a note....

"What is rape?
Rape is a form of sexual assault, but not all sexual assault is rape.[..]" This was only a partial definition from the site. I only copied what I needed.

*She was not fondled.
*Maybe you are having trouble because there were no arguments.