Yes as someone who is Chinese I think the biggest qualm I have is the huge generalization. (And I think it says something when two people of asian descent feel something off from the same statement). Instead, I think it would have been better to say "I see the theme of rape in a lot of the east asian lit that I read." Or something along those lines. But of course, it also comes down to what kind of lit you're reading about. What you describe you're reading makes sense it would have a lot of that because historically, Korea and China have been through it when it comes to being forced to flee or be refugees from war (especially when Japan was in its big imperial stage) so instead of being a reflection on what certain people "like" it's more a reflection of history.
like i said earlier, this is very common in female dominated spaces in erotica. bl is one such space, but so are romance novels and stuff. romanticization of abuse in female writing is a worldwide phenomenon, because it's a common experience or fear for women wherever you are in the world. trends will differ in different countries, but it's quite the generalization to say that asian countries do it more. i'm not an expert, but i feel like it's common across the board. twilight, 50 shades of grey and 365 days are all western books/movies, all with varying types of abuse that get romanticized, and also gained massive popularity (in part bc of infamy, but you get the idea, it gained mainstream notoriety for a reason)
abuse in fiction isn't new, isn't limited to certain regions, and it also isn't immoral. it's a way to explore fears and anxieties in a safe and controlled space. like going on a scary roller coaster, where you can meet your fear of heights head on in a way that doesn't pose a threat to you. it should be warned, tagged and categorized though, cause it's a very upsetting subject, and maybe shouldn't be treated with the levity it sometimes is. but what do i know. not all fiction needs to teach you about the world, or reach a moral quota. that's some christian fundamentalist shit.
Yessss thisssss! This comment is everything
agree my man
And I hate it when they call it love but the only thing they have done so far is sex I can't see any romance just lust (not in this manga but in others I've read)
Let's start off by saying the time it takes for me to respond can also be a factor of the misunderstanding or for things to get blown out of proportion. I can't respond right away cause I don't have as much time as I would like thanks to RL ╥﹏╥
Now then to answer your question...
When I came back to the trend there's no way that was going to happen. Everyone came off aggressive and I believe I responded the right way to that aggression.
Had I not been called racist and someone just said, "hey can you clarify what you said" or "under what assumption are you saying that?" Or "when you say the Asians you mean?"
If someone had just tried to COMMUNICATE with me and told me they found what I said offensive I would have said "hey sorry I didn't mean it that way I'm going on what I've read and I'm meant the Koreans and Chinese."
If anyone of you had tried to communicate with me we could have had a completely different conversation. HOWEVER y'all didn't and y'all came off aggressive and I'm not gonna humble myself to fight talking. Hell someone even tried to intentionally offend me and y'all even called out "the whites" and I'm assuming that that was directed at me because y'all assume that I'm white. I'm supposed to apologize for unintentionally offending y'all when y'all intentionally tried to offend me? (=・ω・=) (●￣(ｴ)￣●) Makes sense.
You can't start shit then expect an apology.
Even if one someone wasn't trying to be aggressive that's how it came off to me with the time gap and the short time I actually had to read and respond.
As someone who speaks English as their first language once we SPECIFIED in the beginning it goes to show that any generalisation after will automatically be linked to the first subject. So when I said the Asians I assumed that everyone would be connecting it back to the Korean and Chinese since I LITERALLY didn't have the time to type all that out as I was stealing chance to read the manga and reply.
I hope this answered your question.
I think I said that in my comment that based on what I, ME as an individual has read, see it a lot in the Chinese and Korean light novels romance and transmigration for both BL and Heterosexual.
In English class I have been taught that once we SPECIFIED in a statement/ a subject prior any generalisation after will automatically be linked back to the SPECIFIED subject/statement.
I had zero intentions of offending anyone in my first comment and I really didn't think it would have been an issue since I was talking about MY experience/past readings. Plus I didn't take into consideration that I also didn't specify that I was speaking about the mangakas and writers taste and preferences, as I was trying to hurry post before my boss was close enough to see me on my phone.
In my head I honestly thought I put
...THESE asians seem to love WRITING trashy male...
Who are you to tell me what to take interest in? I'm not gonna read something I have no interest in when I BARELY have time to read the stuff that I am ACTUALLY interested in.
How am I supposed to know what offended you when you didn't communicate with me or tried to communicate with me? You straight up started on some aggressive shit which I in turn responded to so who is the dumbass?
I think it's continuing and forever going to continue because whether we like it or not like you said it gets glorified and it's something that young teens read so they grow up thinking that it's okay. They make things like Stockholm syndrome seem like no big deal like the lover is just someone who loves you so much that they can't let you go, or she/he is just possessive. Or the famous drug in the drink bit, I see when a male character does it it's a big deal but make a female character to the same she doesn't get flamed as much as when the male does it BUT BOTH are wrong and like it or not BOTH is rape. Or the Party A getting rid of someone, Party B, who has a mutual interest with you Party C just because they love you and can't bare to lose you even if C doesn't feel the same... That's down right psychotic and a mad touch of obsession if you ask me that gets painted quite prettily. Plus if party C ends up with A it just seems like brainwash or Stockholm syndrome right?
I don't know much about western novels or movies as I didn't really have the time to watch them or anything related to vampires/werewolves since they are the demonic and I'll get possessed or 50 shades of grey since it's pornographic and degrading or demeaning to a women everywhere, some Christian excuse parents make about those and anime following things that are not of this world. Plus I've never really enjoyed my teenage years so most of my reading just started happening now.
Well I think it's just something that has been slowly building up until now. Lust has almost always been mistaken for love. Everyone wants love because of how it's being portrayed. Some stuff makes it look so easy while some stuff makes it look so hard. There's little to no communication and trust in most of these "romance" but yet the couple love each other... You can't love someone if you guys don't even communicate with each other and have an understanding, plus if there's no trust then how could there be love?
In all the novels/mangas I've read I've never once seen a really healthy relationship with decent communication. Everyone just speaking with their bodies and because they connect their bodies it's classed or interpret as "love".
I think it's because even in real life people just don't communicate or make an effort to really understand each other. People quick to assume shit and that's where misunderstanding goes and build and BOOM drama. No one ever just says hey hold up but please clarify, or hey can you explain please because the way you said that makes me feel... Or in the novels/mangas no ever be like hey don't get offend or please don't feel a type of way but I saw you today with... They just assume their partner cheating and BOOM drama just so they can find out it's a cousin or some shit. Which in I guess in this area communication can be hard cause no one would willing admit to cheating if they were and anyone would get offended if their lover think they unfaithful when they ain't or well even if they are
you sound racist you know
They (don't wanna assume pronouns jic) don't seem to really understamd what we're getting at so I just give up.
i'm very confused about this reply. first of all, i don't think content creators should ever need to be 'teachers' to young girls about what is and isn't healthy. i already expressed this when i said that abuse in fiction is a way to explore fears and anxieties in a safe and controlled environment. i will always advocate for being able to express yourself in art however you like, and sometimes that means delving into sensitive topics. bl manga or romantic literature isn't for kids, they're not meant to teach you anything, it is on adults in these kids' lives to teach them about healthy relationships and consent. not everyone gets that and that sucks, but that's no reason to not show it in media.
art will always be a reflection of the world, and the world is pretty shit, so things like sexual assault and similar traumas will come up. sometimes these issues aren't treated elegantly, and that's worth discussing, but i never mentioned any of the things you talk about in your reply. not all media is good, and sometimes it does affect people's perception of real life, and all that is worth discussing too. i could talk endlessly about how depictions of gay and trans people in media have shaped people's perception of the lgbtq+ community even to this day, but the conversation is a little different when we talk about the specific subsection of media that is female made erotica. after all, rape fantasy porn on pornhub made by and for a male audience will send a very different message compared to a rape fantasy story in a bl manga made by and for women. for men, they're the perpetrator, it's a power thing. for women, it's also a power thing, but reversed. it's taking back the narrative, it's about victimhood. it's suddenly a completely different thing, and that's because of the collective trauma we women experience (i assume you're a woman from your username, sorry if i'm mistaken). of course men get assaulted too, and that's an important conversation to have (how it's minimized and even made fun of), but men never have to suffer through the constant anxiety of something happening to your body the way women do. it's like they say: men worry about getting embarrassed, women worry about getting murdered. comparing these experiences is impossible, and it's why romance and erotica look so different depending on the gender of the audience.
the importance of a female dominated space for erotica can't be overstated, seeing as women's sexuality have been supressed for literal millenia, and it is still a pretty small space (porn in general is incredibly dominated by male creators), but it's so important to have that space, to explore sexuality, and that includes the ugly and traumatic, because that's so many women's experiences or fears. there is nothing wrong with that. no author should ever have to babysit their readers and point at what is right and wrong to do in the real world. like i said, it should be warned, recognized, and maybe not glorified (glorified and romanticized are not the same thing, btw) but you shouldn't need hand holding through these topics.
we need to talk to young girls about the realities of abuse, we do. we can't expect them to read stories they're not even allowed to (most bl is 18+) and learn about how the world works, because that's not and never has been the purpose of these stories. a solid sex education and transparent conversations about these things will go a long way. censoring everything 'bad' in fiction won't do shit other than echo fascism.
i truly have no idea what you're trying to say in the last paragraph. it's interesting that you drew the conclusion that asian countries often depict abuse in fiction when you realise that you haven't consumed much fiction from other regions, but as long as you realise it i guess. i'm also confused about uh, the rest. were you trying to represent the christian fundamentalist shit i mentioned? cause that's not what i meant, i meant that censoring sex or trying to dictate what's bad and good to depict in erotica was fundamentalist bullshit. or are you saying that's your reason for avoiding western fiction? cause i can assure you that it's safe to consume media with vampires/werewolves, and while 50 shades of grey isn't a good story and a horrible depiction of bdsm, i wouldn't call it demeaning to women. as for it being pornographic, so is bl. we're literally talking about pornography here.
sorry if i've misunderstood something, and i'm also sorry for this being so long, but this topic is kinda important to me as an artist and a feminist.
ヾ(❀╹◡╹)ﾉ~ this, yes^
Actually there is one and it's called Burns(Yaoi). It's short but the end was so satisfying. Give it a try..(▰˘◡˘▰)
I know this weird but can't there be one manga where he doesn't falling in love with the guy who raped