If I could like this comment a hundred times I really really would. Would also like to add that iljo initially had a place to stay, not the best but it was something. If that asshole hadn't been persistent for no reason he would've kept staying as a relative he barely knows. Also hate that iljo was more than likely emotionally abused (maybe physically) and we still don't know how his father treated him later on being that he inherited nothing. But sure Jeonghan is completely in his right to be a manipulative asshole.
Totally agree. Helping others does not give you the right to be a scumbag.
Exactly how I felt and what I think. Thanks for expressing it in such a developped way for many of us.
The few people who disliked your comment are whether stubborn or narrow-minded.
That one (we probably read the same comment) was really quick to label ppl with other views as "14 years old with no grasp of real life" (non verbatim) and I hilariously thought it's probably the other way around.
You have written this well, and idk how others missed this. As far as fictional characters are concerned, I am actually very interested how Jeonghan sees life in his obnoxious lens and I'm looking forward to his future monologues, but I truly cannot agree with the judgment that he hasn't done anything wrong. Because if we're talking about human decency & courtesy, he's far from getting an A. He has been explicitly showing how burdensome it is taking in a freeloader, a decision he is largely at fault. Kudos to him tho, for extending a helping hand, even tho there's not an ounce of sincerity in his actions. *sarcasm here, in case it's missed*
Jeonghan has honestly done nice things, that's a fact, but he's also mean & rude. These can coexist, but some readers are so adamant in just choosing one. These characters are not black and white.
I- You guys, thank you. I was honestly surprised and humbled to find that so many people actually took the time to read this monster of a comment.
(Tbh, I actually felt borderline crazy yesterday for composing such an excessively long comment in the first place. 「(¬▽¬;) I felt like I just had to get it out, but I was also a bit worried I might annoy people by posting something this long here.)
So really, thank you for reading and letting me know I'm not alone in my sentiments. I really appreciate it! (｡'◡'｡)ﾉ
"Also hate that iljo was more than likely emotionally abused (maybe physically) and we still don't know how his father treated him later on being that he inherited nothing."
Right? I also thought that the way he keeps flinching, curling in on himself and making himself smaller all the time kind of does give off a feeling like that. Though at least it really didn't seem like that regarding his relationship with the father, from what we've seen of his childhood so far.. But judging from the memories, I think he may have possibly been severely mistreated / bullied by Jeonghan's other cousins?
Overall, Jeonghan and his other relatives sure seem like a bunch of really "pleasant" people, don't they? (¬¬ ;)
You're right, people who pull the "age card" in this way generally tend to not be very mature themselves. (I suspect that might be because, by a certain age, those people who *are* actually older usually realize it's really not that great of a thing and not necessarily something to be flaunted ╮(￣▽￣)╭ I mean, for my part, I sure wouldn't mind being 14 again, given the chance XD)
And you're very right about the characters being complex and not entirely black and white.(*) I suspect that's one of the reasons why they're so lifelike and why this is actually such a good and engaging read. Though it's at times a bit frustrating, because it's almost making me emphathize a bit too much (I feel like I need Kim Dokja's 4th wall, or something!), I'm still really looking forward to reading more.
(*) (though I still maintain that Iljo is 80-90% an angel, and Jeonghan is 80-90% a jerk )
I've read greensilverscarf as well, you both have wonderful opinions.
+1
So. There have been many comments stating that there was nothing wrong with Jeonghan's behavior, that it was perfectly understandable and utterly normal, but *mainly*, also statements that, actually, the people who thought his behavior was unacceptable were simply naïve kids who didn't understand how "real life" works, and (sorry, I feel like I just have to quote this) "probably the fucking 14 yrs olds", because all of the "grown-ups" supposedly know and agree that no one would ever be ok with a distant relative staying at their place because they don't know them, and that the fact that Jeonghan actually "endures" this already makes him commendable, no matter what else he does.
Actually, greensilverscarf has already addressed a large part of the problem (and imho very well). I'd just really like to address another part from my own viewpoint. (And I apologize in advance because this turned out *very* long, so if you're not one for that, please *absolutely* just skip this – I do understand you're here to read manga, not novels ;)
The thing is, I'd just like to ask people to please not generalize like this. If some of you can emphathize with Jeonghan, that's you. Not, as has been implied, "every reasonable grown-up". For my part, I am one of those people who think his behavior is not ok, and not perfectly normal. Sure, it may not be uncommon, but I still consider it very callous, rude and ultimately unacceptable.
Just because you're doing somebody a favor, even if it's a significant one like letting them live at your place, it does not automatically give you a universal “free pass” to be rude, disparaging, and disregard basic rules of common courtesy. At least that's certainly the way *I* was brought up – if you're going to offer help, it should be sincere, and not something where you deliberately, knowingly make a show of how inconvenienced you are and rub it in the other person's face. (If you're *not* actually willing or able to provide help and you're just going to feel resentful, the more reasonable option – for both sides – is probably still to just be honest about it and not offer. And let's remember that in this particular case, Iljo wasn't even *asking* for it to begin with.)
And just to be perfectly clear – yes, I am certainly old enough and in a position to be able to judge this realistically. I've given this some actual serious thought, and personally, I can honestly say that, if – right now (and I mean this) – an albeit distant relative in that sort of dire situation temporarily had no place to stay due to serious family-related circumstances like this, even if I'd had no contact with them until then – if it was someone with such an overall kind, humble and unassuming personality like this, I'd have no problem with letting that person stay at my place. Honestly, if it was this sort of sweet and helpful person, who even went out their way to not inconvenience me in any way and did all the chores around the house, I might actually welcome it, and appreciate the opportunity to get to know each other better.
Now I imagine if said person actually developed one-sided feelings for me, it would be very uncomfortable, for sure. Though I'd probably feel super awkward about it, rather than actually angry. Either way, it certainly wouldn't lead me to feel the need to lay into and "punish" this shy person who'd visibly flinch at my every harsh word and whom I'd know to have only just lost their only close family after a long and traumatic struggle and be very vulnerable at the moment - in fact, I'd probably assume they were confused about having feelings for me precisely due to their current extreme emotional instability, which in turn would make me pretty concerned (and I'm not going to get into this here again, as it's already been well discussed - but I believe an experience like the one Iljo has been through is truly extremely traumatic and absolutely not to be underestimated).
I guess I'd probably try to give them time to regain their bearings and try to arrange an alternative place to stay, such as with another family member, try to get them surrounded by other kind and friendly people, possibly consider suggesting some form of therapy, maybe even just try to set them up with somebody. And I'd probably attempt to try and steer our relationship in a clearly "family-like" or "friendly" direction instead. All in all, Iljo is a real sweetheart with a very kind personality – I'd want to remain in contact with someone like that, even if I did not like them romantically, I would want us to try and maybe eventually be more like family one day, because people like that are actually very rare in real life.
So I'd just like to clarify that some of us actually do understand and value the importance of other things as well, instead of preferring to just be “left alone” and “in peace”. Sure, the latter might be less of a “bother” at times, but to me, it seems like a pretty lonely and cold existence as well.